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> Ideally, this article would hopefully help de-platform this seller off of Facebook, but we aren't holding our breath on that one. Facebook is basically terrib

> Ideally, this article would hopefully help de-platform this seller off of Facebook, but we aren't holding our breath on that one. Facebook is basically terrible about this, and their existing mechanisms for dealing with reporting sellers like this simply don't work. > [...] > There is no button to click where you can explain to anybody at FB "this is a repeat seller of bikes stolen in Colorado, and here's our proof, and here's our contact info." etc. It is almost as if their system for reporting stolen goods is designed not to work. So "storefront for stolen goods" is another way Facebook makes our lives worse.

g8oz 5y ago
In the 2000s Craigslist was threatened by a coalition of 40 state attorneys general into policing their sex ads....Facebook will need something similar.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  I would rather the government do their job and police and prosecute illegal acts.
  - throwaway82931 5y ago
    Like prosecuting Facebook for colluding in the sale of stolen property?
    - Calvin02 5y ago
      I'm genuinely curious. How would you propose Facebook enforce this? People selling bikes include both first-hand buyers and second-hand buyers (people who bought it from someone else). Without a central registry like what we have for cars, I don't know what Facebook could do.
      - 8note 5y ago
        Disallow selling bikes. If you can't figure out a way to only allow legal resales, you shouldn't be in the business
        novok 5y ago
        And hurt everyone who is legit selling their own bike too.
        Calvin02 5y ago
        If the question is: how do we prevent sale of stolen bikes, I’m not sure how that solves the problem. Is there a possible way for FB and other similar places (offerup, pawn shops, etc.) to verify without some central registry?
        bhance 5y ago
        bike index has an open API
        jcrawfordor 5y ago
        Traditional retailers of used goods like pawn shops are usually subject to pretty stringent regulation - not necessarily to determine if goods are stolen, but to record identification of the seller to enable an investigation later. In some places this does include proactively sending a report of items to the police for checking against stolen reports. So there's a pretty clear precedent for regulation of this kind directed towards online marketplaces, but you can no doubt predict the questions around the difference between a pawn shop (being the seller) and Facebook (being not the seller but just a provider of listings).
      - bhance 5y ago
        States enforce pawn laws through electronic systems like LEADS. FB, offerup, and every other platform out there letting thieves fence things with impunity could implement same.
        5y ago
    - bryan_w 5y ago
      Facebook has all the information any willing police officer/DA would need to capture the thieves. All they would need to do is go to a judge and ask. Also the legislature could make laws to make it easier to send bike thieves to jail. The government != Facebook and it's better that way since we can vote to change things that we find wrong with the government, but lack that ability with FB
- jessaustin 5y ago
  Attorneys general DGAF about cyclists. If they did, there would be more prosecutions for vehicular assault/murder.
  - novok 5y ago
    Wonder if there has been a biking political group that got a 'bicycle DA' elected in and what happened.
walrus01 5y ago
In Vancouver if your bike gets stolen there's also an almost literal storefront for stolen goods. If your bike gets stolen and is worth a few thousand dollars there's a good chance it will turn up within a few hours to a few days at a street market of stolen goods, in a specific several block zone of East Hastings. https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=east+hastings+street+market+vancouver https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=east+hast... If it is really high end (like $7000+ Canadian dollar value) and the theft was targeted rather than random, more likely it might get parted out/sold as components on facebook or sent to another provice for sale by an organized group. Very occasionally Vancouver police or RCMP will find a storage unit full of $7000+ bikes that are being collected together in one place prior to transport out of province.
- hhmc 5y ago
  The thing I find surprising about high-end bike crime -- it seems easy to crack down on -- if there's any desire to do so. Acquire some bait bikes, then put some 40mm GPS trackers somewhere unusual in the bike (the chain stays?), maybe this requires a bit of surgery, but this seems like a relatively small cost. Then raid whatever warehouse they end up in. I guess there's no real political will to do this.
  - walrus01 5y ago
    chainstays seem like it would be a hard technical problem since cutting open/accessing the inside of a chain stay would greatly weaken a bike. and on road bikes/hybrid bikes the chainstay diameter can be quite narrow. Some sort of GPS+LTE data modem and battery might be easily integrated into a seatpost based tracker, or stem, or combined stem-bar unit. A bit tricky since either aluminum or carbon fiber structural components are RF opaque. maybe mounted in one of the areas in the downtube or seat tube that's designed into modern road bikes for ultegra/di2 internal battery mounting, or related to power meter crankset mounting.
    - hhmc 5y ago
      I think the downside of seatpost/stem is that it's more easy to check. Good point about RF, didn't consider that. I still think it's within the realms of possibility though?

g8oz 5y ago

In the 2000s Craigslist was threatened by a coalition of 40 state attorneys general into policing their sex ads....Facebook will need something similar.

lotsofpulp 5y ago
I would rather the government do their job and police and prosecute illegal acts.
- throwaway82931 5y ago
  Like prosecuting Facebook for colluding in the sale of stolen property?
  - Calvin02 5y ago
    I'm genuinely curious. How would you propose Facebook enforce this? People selling bikes include both first-hand buyers and second-hand buyers (people who bought it from someone else). Without a central registry like what we have for cars, I don't know what Facebook could do.
    - 8note 5y ago
      Disallow selling bikes. If you can't figure out a way to only allow legal resales, you shouldn't be in the business
      - novok 5y ago
        And hurt everyone who is legit selling their own bike too.
      - Calvin02 5y ago
        If the question is: how do we prevent sale of stolen bikes, I’m not sure how that solves the problem. Is there a possible way for FB and other similar places (offerup, pawn shops, etc.) to verify without some central registry?
        bhance 5y ago
        bike index has an open API
        jcrawfordor 5y ago
        Traditional retailers of used goods like pawn shops are usually subject to pretty stringent regulation - not necessarily to determine if goods are stolen, but to record identification of the seller to enable an investigation later. In some places this does include proactively sending a report of items to the police for checking against stolen reports. So there's a pretty clear precedent for regulation of this kind directed towards online marketplaces, but you can no doubt predict the questions around the difference between a pawn shop (being the seller) and Facebook (being not the seller but just a provider of listings).
    - bhance 5y ago
      States enforce pawn laws through electronic systems like LEADS. FB, offerup, and every other platform out there letting thieves fence things with impunity could implement same.
      - 5y ago
  - bryan_w 5y ago
    Facebook has all the information any willing police officer/DA would need to capture the thieves. All they would need to do is go to a judge and ask. Also the legislature could make laws to make it easier to send bike thieves to jail. The government != Facebook and it's better that way since we can vote to change things that we find wrong with the government, but lack that ability with FB
jessaustin 5y ago
Attorneys general DGAF about cyclists. If they did, there would be more prosecutions for vehicular assault/murder.
- novok 5y ago
  Wonder if there has been a biking political group that got a 'bicycle DA' elected in and what happened.

walrus01 5y ago

In Vancouver if your bike gets stolen there's also an almost literal storefront for stolen goods. If your bike gets stolen and is worth a few thousand dollars there's a good chance it will turn up within a few hours to a few days at a street market of stolen goods, in a specific several block zone of East Hastings. https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=east+hastings+street+market+vancouver https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=east+hast... If it is really high end (like $7000+ Canadian dollar value) and the theft was targeted rather than random, more likely it might get parted out/sold as components on facebook or sent to another provice for sale by an organized group. Very occasionally Vancouver police or RCMP will find a storage unit full of $7000+ bikes that are being collected together in one place prior to transport out of province.

hhmc 5y ago
The thing I find surprising about high-end bike crime -- it seems easy to crack down on -- if there's any desire to do so. Acquire some bait bikes, then put some 40mm GPS trackers somewhere unusual in the bike (the chain stays?), maybe this requires a bit of surgery, but this seems like a relatively small cost. Then raid whatever warehouse they end up in. I guess there's no real political will to do this.
- walrus01 5y ago
  chainstays seem like it would be a hard technical problem since cutting open/accessing the inside of a chain stay would greatly weaken a bike. and on road bikes/hybrid bikes the chainstay diameter can be quite narrow. Some sort of GPS+LTE data modem and battery might be easily integrated into a seatpost based tracker, or stem, or combined stem-bar unit. A bit tricky since either aluminum or carbon fiber structural components are RF opaque. maybe mounted in one of the areas in the downtube or seat tube that's designed into modern road bikes for ultegra/di2 internal battery mounting, or related to power meter crankset mounting.
  - hhmc 5y ago
    I think the downside of seatpost/stem is that it's more easy to check. Good point about RF, didn't consider that. I still think it's within the realms of possibility though?