3 ms·

> Is this a joke? I don't think it's fair to call it a joke, but if your intention is to shut down discussion that works. There is a robust discussion about bl

> Is this a joke? I don't think it's fair to call it a joke, but if your intention is to shut down discussion that works. There is a robust discussion about blockchain energy usage which doesn't appear to be ideological, but I don't know enough yet to say.

kranke155 5y ago
There are multiple blockchain implementations, many of which now use virtually 1000x less energy than the previous gen. The whole point of the energy consumption was the so called Proof Of Work system, which has been replaced in multiple new blockchains (Polkadot, Tezos, Algorand) with Proof of Stake which has comparatively nil energy usage. Algorand has actually promised to be carbon Negative by buying up carbon credits. The Carbon narrative at this point is really only applicable to two blockchains - Ethereum and Bitcoin. Bitcoin has virtually no smart contract usage, while Ethereum is now in the process of moving towards a Proof of Stake system. The carbon narrative is just that, a narrative. I won’t even try to defend Bitcoin as I find it loathsome in every way.
- mwattsun 5y ago
  Then it appears the complaint that NFTs using too much electricity that you see on Twitter a lot is about Ethereum doing proof of work, which it won't much longer as it transitions to proof of stake. I'm really interested in Chia, which is proof of space. I wouldn't give it much consideration except it's by Bram Cohen who did BitTorrent.
- jollybean 5y ago
  "which has been replaced" - no, because people are still using the 'old way' in which case it's besides the point: blockains are still needlessly consuming copious amounts of energy. There is no 'carbon narrative' there is just a reality that BTC is consuming vast amounts of energy.
  - kranke155 5y ago
    BTC is its own problem. I am talking only about NFTs and chains that make them possible. Major NFT markets now exist in Ethereum, Tezos, Solana and Algorand blockchains. Ethereum is the only one that has this problem and it’s working on ending it through an upgrade.
    - 0xcde4c3db 5y ago
      > Ethereum is the only one that has this problem and it’s working on ending it through an upgrade. It might decline in popularity, but it's unlikely to actually end just because PoS is deployed. Someone will almost certainly rebrand the current PoW-based Ethereum chain+software and continue to maintain and promote it. This already happened once because the Ethereum principals rewrote history after their favorite smart contract turned out to have a major exploit [1] [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_DAO_(organization) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_DAO_(organization) [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic
      - kranke155 5y ago
        That chain, Ethereum Classic, is virtually worthless and unused next to Ethereum itself.

kranke155 5y ago

There are multiple blockchain implementations, many of which now use virtually 1000x less energy than the previous gen. The whole point of the energy consumption was the so called Proof Of Work system, which has been replaced in multiple new blockchains (Polkadot, Tezos, Algorand) with Proof of Stake which has comparatively nil energy usage. Algorand has actually promised to be carbon Negative by buying up carbon credits. The Carbon narrative at this point is really only applicable to two blockchains - Ethereum and Bitcoin. Bitcoin has virtually no smart contract usage, while Ethereum is now in the process of moving towards a Proof of Stake system. The carbon narrative is just that, a narrative. I won’t even try to defend Bitcoin as I find it loathsome in every way.

mwattsun 5y ago
Then it appears the complaint that NFTs using too much electricity that you see on Twitter a lot is about Ethereum doing proof of work, which it won't much longer as it transitions to proof of stake. I'm really interested in Chia, which is proof of space. I wouldn't give it much consideration except it's by Bram Cohen who did BitTorrent.
jollybean 5y ago
"which has been replaced" - no, because people are still using the 'old way' in which case it's besides the point: blockains are still needlessly consuming copious amounts of energy. There is no 'carbon narrative' there is just a reality that BTC is consuming vast amounts of energy.
- kranke155 5y ago
  BTC is its own problem. I am talking only about NFTs and chains that make them possible. Major NFT markets now exist in Ethereum, Tezos, Solana and Algorand blockchains. Ethereum is the only one that has this problem and it’s working on ending it through an upgrade.
  - 0xcde4c3db 5y ago
    > Ethereum is the only one that has this problem and it’s working on ending it through an upgrade. It might decline in popularity, but it's unlikely to actually end just because PoS is deployed. Someone will almost certainly rebrand the current PoW-based Ethereum chain+software and continue to maintain and promote it. This already happened once because the Ethereum principals rewrote history after their favorite smart contract turned out to have a major exploit [1] [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_DAO_(organization) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_DAO_(organization) [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum_Classic
    - kranke155 5y ago
      That chain, Ethereum Classic, is virtually worthless and unused next to Ethereum itself.