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Incidentally, this morning I finished reading the Socratic dialogue, 'Phaedrus'[1]. At the end of the dialogue (and also in a couple of other dialogues), Socrat

Incidentally, this morning I finished reading the Socratic dialogue, 'Phaedrus'[1]. At the end of the dialogue (and also in a couple of other dialogues), Socrates makes his famous rebuttal against writing: You know, Phaedrus, writing shares a strange feature with painting. The offsprings of painting stand there as if they are alive, but if anyone asks them anything, they remain most solemnly silent. The same is true of written words. You'd think they were speaking as if they had some understanding, but if you question anything that has been said because you want to learn more, it continues to signify just that very same thing forever. When it has once been written down, every discourse roams about everywhere, reaching indiscriminately those with understanding no less than those who have no business with it, and it [writing] doesn't know whom it should speak and to whom it should not. And when it is faulted and attacked unfairly, it always needs its father's [the writer's] support; alone, it can neither defend itself nor come to its own support. - - - What is Socrates' proposed solution, then? A combination of two things: (1) of course, the so-called Socratic method (elenchus in Greek) of refutation, that teases out better hypotheses by "identifying and eliminating contradictions", and (2) the "art of dialectic", i.e. the art of investigating the truth, which Plato makes Socrates use in his later dialogues such as the Republic. I'm sure we don't miss the irony here—we gain many of Socrates' insights, regardless of what we think of them, thanks to Plato's writing. PS: I agree with you on books, modulo this: it's more likely to see pigs flying than to see "books starting to slowly fade away" :-) [1] This English translation (by Nehamas & Woodruff) is excellent: https://www.hackettpublishing.com/philosophy/phaedrus https://www.hackettpublishing.com/philosophy/phaedrus

kinghtown 5y ago
After reading a few of the dialogues, love reading these BTW, I highly suspect that Plato often misrepresented Socrates- would often put words in his mouth. With that said.. I think it’s very OK for Socrates to be wrong or to disagree with him. He’s the kind of guy who would change his opinions in light of conflicting evidence or an iron clad logical argument. Just because he said that about writing doesn’t mean he’s right nor does it mean he’s done with the tangent.
- kashyapc 5y ago
  I forgot to add: Socrates actually does sort of say that even writing is okay—as long as you're doing it in the right spirit (seeking truth) and are not deceiving your audience. In the Phaedrus, Socrates rails against the "speechmakers" who don't truly know what they're talking about, but instead write based on "what is likely" to persuade the audience. And yes, in the later dialogues (e.g. the Republic), many scholars agree that Plato used Socrates as his "mouthpiece". I don't care either way, they're insanely fun to read.

kinghtown 5y ago

After reading a few of the dialogues, love reading these BTW, I highly suspect that Plato often misrepresented Socrates- would often put words in his mouth. With that said.. I think it’s very OK for Socrates to be wrong or to disagree with him. He’s the kind of guy who would change his opinions in light of conflicting evidence or an iron clad logical argument. Just because he said that about writing doesn’t mean he’s right nor does it mean he’s done with the tangent.

kashyapc 5y ago
I forgot to add: Socrates actually does sort of say that even writing is okay—as long as you're doing it in the right spirit (seeking truth) and are not deceiving your audience. In the Phaedrus, Socrates rails against the "speechmakers" who don't truly know what they're talking about, but instead write based on "what is likely" to persuade the audience. And yes, in the later dialogues (e.g. the Republic), many scholars agree that Plato used Socrates as his "mouthpiece". I don't care either way, they're insanely fun to read.