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> If the schools remove academic testing credentials OP loses the ability to use test scores as a means of entry, which would have potentially levelled the play

> If the schools remove academic testing credentials OP loses the ability to use test scores as a means of entry, which would have potentially levelled the playing field. This doesn't track. College admissions tests are a huge area of concern when it comes to institutionalized racism (due to the racial wealth gap). They don't test anything other than an applicant's ability to do well on the test, and that is primarily determined by (a) the applicant's to spend time studying for the test and (b) the applicant's ability to utilize resources to study for the test. (a) tips testing in favor of the wealthy because poor people cannot afford to spend time studying, and (b) tips testing in favor of the wealthy because poor people cannot afford to spend money on test prep materials. Compound this with the fact that the tests are fairly expensive themselves, so even retaking the test is often out of the question for people with few means, compared to wealthy students who can retake the test as many times as they like. The idea that entrance exams balanced things in favor of people from lower socioeconomic classes is, and always has been, a bunch of malarkey.

usaar333 5y ago
> The idea that entrance exams balanced things in favor of people from lower socioeconomic classes is, and always has been, a bunch of malarkey. You are looking at this absolutely, not relatively. The rest of the admissions criteria have similar issues you raise, if not worse. (Essays and interviews especially risk class bias) > They don't test anything other than an applicant's ability to do well on the test, and that is primarily determined by (a) the applicant's to spend time studying for the test and (b) the applicant's ability to utilize resources to study for the test. Citation needed here. They are quite predictive of college success (GPA) which is why they are used.
- DonaldPShimoda 5y ago
  > You are looking at this absolutely, not relatively. I do appreciate this point, but I still don't think it's enough to warrant keeping exams in-place. I think we should remove them while also striving to improve the rest of the college admissions process. Having a metric that claims to level the playing field but actually does not is, in my opinion, more harmful than other metrics that are less straightforward. It gives false hope and also allows for a more dastardly scheme of classism, since it is centralized instead of managed separately by each university. > They are quite predictive of college success (GPA) which is why they are used. I think they are indicative of socioeconomic standing, which in turn is predictive of GPA. Students who can afford tutoring, or who have parents who have free time to help while growing up, or who do not need to take on extra jobs, or who don't generally worry about other such stressors that are typically due to low socioeconomic status are consistently shown to achieve greater academic success at all grades, even as early as first grade. Socioeconomic status is the #1 predictor of academic success, and this is reflected by college entrance exams. Keep in mind that it is in the best interests of these organizations to intentionally avoid addressing this point. Also, it's worth remembering that college entrance exams trace their origins back to purported tests of general intelligence that were in fact designed with intentional cultural bias to prevent non-white students from finding admission at universities. (This was later addressed and somewhat rectified, in some ways, but my points is that the organizations responsible have a history of not really caring about crafting a test in the best interests of the student.)

usaar333 5y ago

> The idea that entrance exams balanced things in favor of people from lower socioeconomic classes is, and always has been, a bunch of malarkey. You are looking at this absolutely, not relatively. The rest of the admissions criteria have similar issues you raise, if not worse. (Essays and interviews especially risk class bias) > They don't test anything other than an applicant's ability to do well on the test, and that is primarily determined by (a) the applicant's to spend time studying for the test and (b) the applicant's ability to utilize resources to study for the test. Citation needed here. They are quite predictive of college success (GPA) which is why they are used.

DonaldPShimoda 5y ago
> You are looking at this absolutely, not relatively. I do appreciate this point, but I still don't think it's enough to warrant keeping exams in-place. I think we should remove them while also striving to improve the rest of the college admissions process. Having a metric that claims to level the playing field but actually does not is, in my opinion, more harmful than other metrics that are less straightforward. It gives false hope and also allows for a more dastardly scheme of classism, since it is centralized instead of managed separately by each university. > They are quite predictive of college success (GPA) which is why they are used. I think they are indicative of socioeconomic standing, which in turn is predictive of GPA. Students who can afford tutoring, or who have parents who have free time to help while growing up, or who do not need to take on extra jobs, or who don't generally worry about other such stressors that are typically due to low socioeconomic status are consistently shown to achieve greater academic success at all grades, even as early as first grade. Socioeconomic status is the #1 predictor of academic success, and this is reflected by college entrance exams. Keep in mind that it is in the best interests of these organizations to intentionally avoid addressing this point. Also, it's worth remembering that college entrance exams trace their origins back to purported tests of general intelligence that were in fact designed with intentional cultural bias to prevent non-white students from finding admission at universities. (This was later addressed and somewhat rectified, in some ways, but my points is that the organizations responsible have a history of not really caring about crafting a test in the best interests of the student.)