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I was really hoping to see Apple acknowledging that they were helping rather than assuming based on code changes that make it seem like they are. However, happy

I was really hoping to see Apple acknowledging that they were helping rather than assuming based on code changes that make it seem like they are. However, happy to see the direction this is going. I’m grateful for the work of both sides.

Nbox9 5y ago
I would 10x rather see Apple helping than see Apple say they are helping.
- bombcar 5y ago
  Not saying anything and helping is much better than saying you're helping and doing nothing. By not being official, they can probably do more internally.
  - phkahler 5y ago
    >> By not being official, they can probably do more internally. People don't often think about that, but in some cases it's very true.
deleted 5y ago
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GeekyBear 5y ago
"Microsoft loves open source, so please ignore the way we are stripping hot reload out of .Net 6 to force you to buy Visual Studio instead" would be an improvement? Deeds, not words.
flyinghamster 5y ago
Even it for $REASONS it has to be informal, seeing some active help from Apple is a sight for sore eyes. This is absolutely welcome news.
dagmx 5y ago
A company saying they're helping has lots of side effects people don't think about: - it means they've made a public commitment to a project, and suddenly will get bombarded by other projects, making them less willing to engage again - any failure of the project to run well will also be a reflection of the company, even if it's outside their control. - it can be seen as an endorsement of a single project, when multiple ones might benefit. Also if that one project becomes problematic it is hard to detangle. - the commitment to it would make it difficult to move in a different, better direction if needed in the future
- pedrocr 5y ago
  They don't need to endorse Asahi to endorse the use of alternative OS on ARM Macs, which wouldn't have any of those downsides. The first Intel Macs were great machines to run Linux on. Later machines had too many compatibility issues. From that experience I'll steer away from Macs as I have no interest in OSX and don't trust them to not break Linux. If they publicly commited to alternative OS friendliness that would go a very long way for me.
  - dochtman 5y ago
    It's different with Apple Silicon because their hardware is more differentiated; meaning it might be more interesting for them to see non-macOS usage for it.
  - dagmx 5y ago
    If the bar is just supporting the use of alternative OS's, they've already done that. Craig Federighi (their SVP of software) mentioned that support for other OSs is an explicit goal of their boot setup in interviews.
    - pedrocr 5y ago
      Allowing booting other OSs is different than actually supporting those efforts with documentation for example. The problem with Intel Macs is not being able to boot another kernel it's all the device support that's now gone.

Nbox9 5y ago

I would 10x rather see Apple helping than see Apple say they are helping.

bombcar 5y ago
Not saying anything and helping is much better than saying you're helping and doing nothing. By not being official, they can probably do more internally.
- phkahler 5y ago
  >> By not being official, they can probably do more internally. People don't often think about that, but in some cases it's very true.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

GeekyBear 5y ago

"Microsoft loves open source, so please ignore the way we are stripping hot reload out of .Net 6 to force you to buy Visual Studio instead" would be an improvement? Deeds, not words.

flyinghamster 5y ago

Even it for $REASONS it has to be informal, seeing some active help from Apple is a sight for sore eyes. This is absolutely welcome news.

dagmx 5y ago

A company saying they're helping has lots of side effects people don't think about: - it means they've made a public commitment to a project, and suddenly will get bombarded by other projects, making them less willing to engage again - any failure of the project to run well will also be a reflection of the company, even if it's outside their control. - it can be seen as an endorsement of a single project, when multiple ones might benefit. Also if that one project becomes problematic it is hard to detangle. - the commitment to it would make it difficult to move in a different, better direction if needed in the future

pedrocr 5y ago
They don't need to endorse Asahi to endorse the use of alternative OS on ARM Macs, which wouldn't have any of those downsides. The first Intel Macs were great machines to run Linux on. Later machines had too many compatibility issues. From that experience I'll steer away from Macs as I have no interest in OSX and don't trust them to not break Linux. If they publicly commited to alternative OS friendliness that would go a very long way for me.
- dochtman 5y ago
  It's different with Apple Silicon because their hardware is more differentiated; meaning it might be more interesting for them to see non-macOS usage for it.
- dagmx 5y ago
  If the bar is just supporting the use of alternative OS's, they've already done that. Craig Federighi (their SVP of software) mentioned that support for other OSs is an explicit goal of their boot setup in interviews.
  - pedrocr 5y ago
    Allowing booting other OSs is different than actually supporting those efforts with documentation for example. The problem with Intel Macs is not being able to boot another kernel it's all the device support that's now gone.