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> All voting systems kind of suck and suffer from mathematical and political paradoxes. Yes. Arrow's Impossibility Theorem. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arro
by Turing_Machine 5y ago
> All voting systems kind of suck and suffer from mathematical and political paradoxes.
Yes. Arrow's Impossibility Theorem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrow%27s_impossibility_theorem https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrow%27s_impossibility_theore...
That said, some systems are clearly worse than others.
- ClayShentrup 5y agoArrow's theorem only really applies to social welfare functions not voting methods. You use a utilitarian social welfare function when you calculate Bayesian regret for a voting method. https://www.rangevoting.org/ArrowThm https://www.rangevoting.org/ArrowThm
- bedobi 5y ago> Arrow's impossibility theorem Ah, that's it, thanks, I was looking for it but forgot what it was called. There's also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_paradox https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_paradox (and any number of other ones that may or may not even have names)
- gpm 5y agoArrows impossibility theorem only proves things about voting systems where the method of voting is simply ranking the candidates in an order, so it doesn't actually apply to this quadratic voting system. Does anyone happen to know if an analogous theorem does apply to this quadratic voting system?
- ClayShentrup 5y agoQuadratic voting is an extremely irrational idea. https://www.rangevoting.org/MonetizedRV https://www.rangevoting.org/MonetizedRV
- DennisP 5y agoRange voting and approval voting aren't subject to anything similar, according to William Poundstone's book Gaming the Vote. If that's correct then I'd think quadratic voting is the same.
- Turing_Machine 5y agoATW, score voting (which some call range voting) and approval voting both suffer from the defect that a choice that is favored by an absolute majority (which would thus win in a "normal" election) can wind up losing. That wouldn't have to happen very often to lead to a lot of very angry voters.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- notriddle 5y agoAustralia’s system (IRV) doesn’t necessarily elect the Condorcet winner, either, and it hasn’t led to mass revolts.
- bedobi 5y agoWell, you have to be aware of the potential quirks in the system, and Australians are not, they uncritically know their system is infallible and the best.
- dodobirdlord 5y agoHow can approval voting suffer from this defect? Is the idea here that we factor in people who don’t vote for things they actually favor because they’re hoping to avoid tipping the result away from something they favor even more? Or do you mean an election could end up selecting a result that is favored by the majority even though there is a different result that is more favored by a smaller majority?
- Turing_Machine 5y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Approval_voting#Effect_on_elections https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Approval_voting#Effect_on_elec...
- DennisP 5y ago
- bedobi 5y agoTry the online demo they made at https://www.economist.com/interactives/2021/12/18/quadratic-voting https://www.economist.com/interactives/2021/12/18/quadratic-... it's cool but tbh I would rather have infinite points to spend, at which point you might as well have binary endorse / oppose votes (maybe with an added option abstain) point being that I don't think the intensity of my endorsement of policies to combat climate change should cost anything for my equally intense endorsement of paying reparations for colonialism - I consider both incredibly important and essential policies.
- paulpauper 5y agoputting science in political science.