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> Your lack of understanding is a valuable attribute that goes away as you gain experience Not necessarily true. Beginner's mind can be embraced by anyone who

> Your lack of understanding is a valuable attribute that goes away as you gain experience Not necessarily true. Beginner's mind can be embraced by anyone who stays humble. Some of my favorite people to work with have ample experience, but approach each new challenge from the ground up.

joshcanhelp 5y ago
I agree. In fact this post was inspired by someone I work with who embodies this mindset. I probably could have said something more along the lines of it fades naturally unless you mindfully keep it around. That quality, though, feels like a hard one to learn. Not impossible but it seems like it comes naturally to some and not to others.
- errantmind 5y ago
  In a society dominated by signalling, few want to risk looking like they don't know what they are doing. They fear people will mistake humility for incompetence
  - tejtm 5y ago
    It is not an unfounded fear, especially with people not capable of understanding what you are being gracious about.
  - mattgreenrocks 5y ago
    The irony is that true competence demands the ability to inhabit beginners mind when necessary in order to continually hone one’s skills.
  - joshcanhelp 5y ago
    100%, I totally agree. I linked to an article [1] that talked about one person's experience with this. My argument here is that I believe it's overall better to accept that risk and important to encourage that in others. [1] https://danluu.com/look-stupid/ https://danluu.com/look-stupid/
thanhhaimai 5y ago
> Not necessarily true. Beginner's mind can be embraced by anyone who stays humble. Beginner's mind can be simulated by anyone who stays humble. I can give you the most humble and competent person. The most they can do is to "guess", or in a better term, simulate how another mind will think. It depends on multiple factors, including culture, education, and environment they are in. Sometimes, the best way is to just ask/observe a real beginner's mind.
- errantmind 5y ago
  Mostly agreed but I'd say it goes beyond simulation. You can have experience but refuse to make a lot of assumptions about the task at hand, instead feeling it out by asking questions and trying to determine if past approaches are really suited. The opposite of this are people who approach any task with a solution in mind, devoid of context.
  - kwhitefoot 5y ago
    > but refuse to make a lot of assumptions You can try but a lot of the assumptions are unconscious, unknown to you.
jiveturkey 5y ago
not really. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_knowledge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_knowledge
Barrin92 5y ago
I think the opposite makes it even clearer that state of mind and actual expertise aren't the same thing, plenty of beginners without a beginner's mind
- roeles 5y ago
  Isn't that then the dunning-kruger effect?

joshcanhelp 5y ago

I agree. In fact this post was inspired by someone I work with who embodies this mindset. I probably could have said something more along the lines of it fades naturally unless you mindfully keep it around. That quality, though, feels like a hard one to learn. Not impossible but it seems like it comes naturally to some and not to others.

errantmind 5y ago
In a society dominated by signalling, few want to risk looking like they don't know what they are doing. They fear people will mistake humility for incompetence
- tejtm 5y ago
  It is not an unfounded fear, especially with people not capable of understanding what you are being gracious about.
- mattgreenrocks 5y ago
  The irony is that true competence demands the ability to inhabit beginners mind when necessary in order to continually hone one’s skills.
- joshcanhelp 5y ago
  100%, I totally agree. I linked to an article [1] that talked about one person's experience with this. My argument here is that I believe it's overall better to accept that risk and important to encourage that in others. [1] https://danluu.com/look-stupid/ https://danluu.com/look-stupid/

thanhhaimai 5y ago

> Not necessarily true. Beginner's mind can be embraced by anyone who stays humble. Beginner's mind can be simulated by anyone who stays humble. I can give you the most humble and competent person. The most they can do is to "guess", or in a better term, simulate how another mind will think. It depends on multiple factors, including culture, education, and environment they are in. Sometimes, the best way is to just ask/observe a real beginner's mind.

errantmind 5y ago
Mostly agreed but I'd say it goes beyond simulation. You can have experience but refuse to make a lot of assumptions about the task at hand, instead feeling it out by asking questions and trying to determine if past approaches are really suited. The opposite of this are people who approach any task with a solution in mind, devoid of context.
- kwhitefoot 5y ago
  > but refuse to make a lot of assumptions You can try but a lot of the assumptions are unconscious, unknown to you.

jiveturkey 5y ago

not really. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_knowledge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_knowledge

Barrin92 5y ago

I think the opposite makes it even clearer that state of mind and actual expertise aren't the same thing, plenty of beginners without a beginner's mind

roeles 5y ago
Isn't that then the dunning-kruger effect?