5 ms·

> Lazy: Send it to Gemini, buy 600k worth of GUSD, loan it on their Lend program and collect 8%pa compounded monthly. Why would you bother with this when TIPS

> Lazy: Send it to Gemini, buy 600k worth of GUSD, loan it on their Lend program and collect 8%pa compounded monthly. Why would you bother with this when TIPS bonds are paying out 7.12%?

randomhodler84 5y ago
Yeah. A lot of folks are talking about inflation bonds (not TIPS). I dunno man. I trust the winklevoss, 2 of the richest men on the planet (in Bitcoin, which is the only money that matters ;-)). Why? Because a inflation protected security is denominated in the currency that is inflating. It’s kinda nonsensical really. How to achieve those returns? It’s money printing isn’t it. In the 20% extreme high yield example above, providing liquidity is a service, extremely meaningful in globalized digital economies. I strongly recommend the crazy option. But that’s just me cos I’m crazy. :-)
- beervirus 5y ago
  Bitcoin isn’t money. It’s a gambling token.
  - randomhodler84 5y ago
    What is money? What is the role of the state in the value of currencies? What is the average life of fiat currencies? https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/ https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/
    - beervirus 5y ago
      Money doesn’t fluctuate in value 50% on a timescale of minutes.
      - randomhodler84 5y ago
        I mean, it can. Not minutes, and minutes means internet speeds. Old school finance is in the order of days. Securities can collapse in minutes too I guess… Fiat currencies inflate and are worth less every year. In some places in the world, relative to the USD, which itself is an inflationary fiat currency, it could be 50%! What if you gave your life’s labor and saved it all in something a politician and banker could erase with a database record.
        beervirus 5y ago
        >I mean, it can. >Not minutes So… it can’t?
        randomhodler84 5y ago
        Yes. It can. And has. Currencies collapse all the time. We have many examples throughout history where extreme events led to values in day to day currencies fluctuate wildly. I get it. You need the dollar to pay your debts, your goods and services and your tax. This is the same as every human ever in history in their respective daily transactional token. (US) Dollars are good, and will be how people pay for things around the world in some form or another for many many years to come. However, we must not forget that it is a fiat currency, and as such value is at the whim of the politician and banker. Regarding the wild scary world of decentralized stores or value, cryptocurrency tokens, Bitcoin. Ethereum. It is scary to see your savings fluctuate wildly. It does however grant some perspective on the system. Money is the shared delusion that some token is worth some goods or services to other humans, or systems. The systems part is where it gets interesting, down the rabbit hole. Sometimes we want to trust the math, rather than trust the man or trust the gun. The smartest people on earth seem pretty ok with the math; but they don’t always have the confidence of the man or the gun. It is a fairly new concept to apply planetary value structures to decentralized peer to peer networks. What if, in the future, we implemented protocols that enabled the same meta patterns we see emerge in existing systems, like the global equity and capital markets, commodities and financial instruments and implemented them on permission-less systems, with no gatekeepers, no old guard to enforce arbitrary discriminatory and rules, only math. Would that not empower humanity? Could it not break down existing long lived biases and systems of oppression? Freedom through mathematics.
    - jedberg 5y ago
      > What is the role of the state in the value of currencies? They provide the violence to back up the value of the currency. A currency is only as valuable as the courts and ultimately the army that backs it.
3np 5y ago
Are TIPS bonds accessible outside the US for non-Americans?
- murderfs 5y ago
  AFAIK, TreasuryDirect should be available to non-Americans. You'll need to get a U.S. Tax Identification Number, and figure out your tax situation though: it'll vary from country to country based on treaties with the U.S.
  - 3np 5y ago
    Looked it up. https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/help/TDHelp/faq.htm#OpenAnAccount https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/help/TDHelp/faq.htm#Ope... > In order to open a TreasuryDirect account, an individual or entity account manager must have a valid Social Security Number (SSN), be 18 years of age or over, and be legally competent. An entity must have a valid SSN or Employer Identification Number (EIN). The account owner must also have a United States address of record and have an account at a U.S. depository financial institution that will accept debits and credits using the Automated Clearing House method of payment. AFAIUI, getting an SSN from abroad as a non-US citizen/resident is not realistic.
    - murderfs 5y ago
      Ah, yeah, you're right. You can probably still buy them through a broker, though. Searching around a bit, it looks like you should be able to open an account with Schwab: https://international.schwab.com/ https://international.schwab.com/
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
  - gruez 5y ago
    The account might be available to non-americans, but I-bonds aren't. >Who may own an I bond? >Individuals >Yes, if you have a Social Security Number and meet any one of these three conditions: > United States citizen, whether you live in the U.S. or abroad > United States resident > Civilian employee of the United States, no matter where you live >To buy and own an electronic I bond, you must first establish a TreasuryDirect account. https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds/res_ibonds_ibuy.htm https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds...
medvezhenok 5y ago
Series I Bonds, not TIPS; they only have that rate locked in for the next 6 months (you're getting a 0 percent real return), and you can only buy $10K per year (+$5K if you do the tax return withholding method).

> Lazy: Send it to Gemini, buy 600k worth of GUSD, loan it on their Lend program and collect 8%pa compounded monthly. Why would you bother with this when TIPS bonds are paying out 7.12%?

randomhodler84 5y ago

Yeah. A lot of folks are talking about inflation bonds (not TIPS). I dunno man. I trust the winklevoss, 2 of the richest men on the planet (in Bitcoin, which is the only money that matters ;-)). Why? Because a inflation protected security is denominated in the currency that is inflating. It’s kinda nonsensical really. How to achieve those returns? It’s money printing isn’t it. In the 20% extreme high yield example above, providing liquidity is a service, extremely meaningful in globalized digital economies. I strongly recommend the crazy option. But that’s just me cos I’m crazy. :-)

beervirus 5y ago
Bitcoin isn’t money. It’s a gambling token.
- randomhodler84 5y ago
  What is money? What is the role of the state in the value of currencies? What is the average life of fiat currencies? https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/ https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/
  - beervirus 5y ago
    Money doesn’t fluctuate in value 50% on a timescale of minutes.
    - randomhodler84 5y ago
      I mean, it can. Not minutes, and minutes means internet speeds. Old school finance is in the order of days. Securities can collapse in minutes too I guess… Fiat currencies inflate and are worth less every year. In some places in the world, relative to the USD, which itself is an inflationary fiat currency, it could be 50%! What if you gave your life’s labor and saved it all in something a politician and banker could erase with a database record.
      - beervirus 5y ago
        >I mean, it can. >Not minutes So… it can’t?
        randomhodler84 5y ago
        Yes. It can. And has. Currencies collapse all the time. We have many examples throughout history where extreme events led to values in day to day currencies fluctuate wildly. I get it. You need the dollar to pay your debts, your goods and services and your tax. This is the same as every human ever in history in their respective daily transactional token. (US) Dollars are good, and will be how people pay for things around the world in some form or another for many many years to come. However, we must not forget that it is a fiat currency, and as such value is at the whim of the politician and banker. Regarding the wild scary world of decentralized stores or value, cryptocurrency tokens, Bitcoin. Ethereum. It is scary to see your savings fluctuate wildly. It does however grant some perspective on the system. Money is the shared delusion that some token is worth some goods or services to other humans, or systems. The systems part is where it gets interesting, down the rabbit hole. Sometimes we want to trust the math, rather than trust the man or trust the gun. The smartest people on earth seem pretty ok with the math; but they don’t always have the confidence of the man or the gun. It is a fairly new concept to apply planetary value structures to decentralized peer to peer networks. What if, in the future, we implemented protocols that enabled the same meta patterns we see emerge in existing systems, like the global equity and capital markets, commodities and financial instruments and implemented them on permission-less systems, with no gatekeepers, no old guard to enforce arbitrary discriminatory and rules, only math. Would that not empower humanity? Could it not break down existing long lived biases and systems of oppression? Freedom through mathematics.
  - jedberg 5y ago
    > What is the role of the state in the value of currencies? They provide the violence to back up the value of the currency. A currency is only as valuable as the courts and ultimately the army that backs it.

3np 5y ago

Are TIPS bonds accessible outside the US for non-Americans?

murderfs 5y ago
AFAIK, TreasuryDirect should be available to non-Americans. You'll need to get a U.S. Tax Identification Number, and figure out your tax situation though: it'll vary from country to country based on treaties with the U.S.
- 3np 5y ago
  Looked it up. https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/help/TDHelp/faq.htm#OpenAnAccount https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/help/TDHelp/faq.htm#Ope... > In order to open a TreasuryDirect account, an individual or entity account manager must have a valid Social Security Number (SSN), be 18 years of age or over, and be legally competent. An entity must have a valid SSN or Employer Identification Number (EIN). The account owner must also have a United States address of record and have an account at a U.S. depository financial institution that will accept debits and credits using the Automated Clearing House method of payment. AFAIUI, getting an SSN from abroad as a non-US citizen/resident is not realistic.
  - murderfs 5y ago
    Ah, yeah, you're right. You can probably still buy them through a broker, though. Searching around a bit, it looks like you should be able to open an account with Schwab: https://international.schwab.com/ https://international.schwab.com/
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- gruez 5y ago
  The account might be available to non-americans, but I-bonds aren't. >Who may own an I bond? >Individuals >Yes, if you have a Social Security Number and meet any one of these three conditions: > United States citizen, whether you live in the U.S. or abroad > United States resident > Civilian employee of the United States, no matter where you live >To buy and own an electronic I bond, you must first establish a TreasuryDirect account. https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds/res_ibonds_ibuy.htm https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds...

medvezhenok 5y ago

Series I Bonds, not TIPS; they only have that rate locked in for the next 6 months (you're getting a 0 percent real return), and you can only buy $10K per year (+$5K if you do the tax return withholding method).