5 ms·

As much as I love Jason Donenfeld's work, I tried to use pass and the gpg requirement just rubbed me the wrong way. It's basically just gpg-encrpyting a text fi

As much as I love Jason Donenfeld's work, I tried to use pass and the gpg requirement just rubbed me the wrong way. It's basically just gpg-encrpyting a text file and unlocking that along with some wrappers for basic password manager functionality (I guess most important is clipboard functionality and clearing it automatically after some seconds), but somehow that seems like a weak point to me. It's a whole lot of reliance on one extremely bloated suite of applications when I feel like something standalone and about as compact would be better somehow.

yepguy 5y ago
A few pass-related projects are working on an age[1] backend in addition to gpg. I think gopass already has support for it. [1]: https://age-encryption.org/ https://age-encryption.org/
- zikduruqe 5y ago
  Here's one I have been playing with success. https://github.com/chrisswanda/passage https://github.com/chrisswanda/passage
- tex0 5y ago
  Correct. Gopass has very early age support. It fully works but the UX is not great (yet).
  - pqb 5y ago
    Oh dammit. I have stopped using Gopass and rewrote pass just for that reason - missing AGE encryption. At least I have learned something new and I feel I have better UI - fuzzy finder instead of their TUI. However, big kudos to Gopass team for awesome work and really useful tool. Before I start working on next project... Do you recognize any mobile app, which could replace PasswordStore app for Android [0] but with AGE support? [0]: https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-Store https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-S...
    - yepguy 5y ago
      Android Password Store itself is keen to add age support[1], but I don't know of anything usable right now. You could probably use gopass in termux in the mean time. [1]: https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-Store/issues/1195#issuecomment-808940598 https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-S...
      - pqb 5y ago
        Oh, that's an awesome news. Thank you!
    - cobby 5y ago
      > missing AGE encryption I am just curious. What makes AGE backend better than GPG one?
      - yepguy 5y ago
        Age is much simpler to use in nearly every way, whether that's interactively (keys are just files!), in scripting, or in implementation. I'm still sticking to gpg for the foreseeable future, but between age and sequoia[1] I'm hopeful that things will soon be much easier to use. [1]: https://sequoia-pgp.org/ https://sequoia-pgp.org/
      - pqb 5y ago
        As yepguy mentioned AGE is simpler. I can also mention few things: - It works smoothly with SSH keys (generated from ssh-keygen), which are perfectly recognized by possibly any developer. - No need for external client, such as GpgWin/Kleopatra for Windows. - Embed-able in Rust[0] and Go[1] (there are libraries), no need to call `gpg --decrypt ...` from the command line. - Encrypted files by pass and keys are smaller. I guess it is thanks to ecliptic-curve encryption. [0]: https://github.com/str4d/rage https://github.com/str4d/rage [1]: https://github.com/FiloSottile/age https://github.com/FiloSottile/age
HotHotLava 5y ago
As a user, I also often feel like `gpg` brings a lot of annoying accidental complexity to `pass`, (like the need to "ultimately trust" keys before they become usable) but on the other hand it enables integration with hardware tokens like Yubikeys and in extension mobile devices (via openkeychain) that as far as I know wouldn't be possible with a more modern age-based backend.
- beagle3 5y ago
  SSH has included file encryption for a few versions now, and iirc supports yubikeys — probably would be more useful a backend than age.
  - tialaramex 5y ago
    > SSH has included file encryption for a few versions now Mmm. I don't think so. Recent OpenSSH includes file signatures not encryption.
    - beagle3 5y ago
      Ahh, you are correct, I misremembered.
- _abox 5y ago
  Yep the integration with Yubikey is amazing. Both on mobile and desktop <3
- yepguy 5y ago
  https://github.com/str4d/age-plugin-yubikey https://github.com/str4d/age-plugin-yubikey
- upofadown 5y ago
  >like the need to "ultimately trust" keys before they become usable Did you have to do that manually at one time? All the keypairs that I make start out that way when created. When creating a keypair for pass all you have to do is generate the key using defaults while remembering a bit of the user ID to give to pass.
rank0 5y ago
I get what you’re saying but it’s just different philosophies no? Seems like pass wants to use the Unix philosophy of “do one thing well” so it relies on gpg for encryption instead of rolling its own.
vngzs 5y ago
Besides that, pass leaks metadata. If your passwords are the only part of your password manager you think are secret, then you're probably not considering the utility of an enumeration of all your network handles. Mine aren't very interesting, but I wouldn't post that on GitHub, even in a private repo. I love pass and use it. But when I need to carry my password database around, I don't rely on pass alone - I throw the pass database in a Veracrypt container. That way if my flash drive is stolen, it's just an encrypted blob.
- karlding 5y ago
  There's also the pass-tomb extension [0] which stores the directory in a tomb [1]. [0] https://github.com/roddhjav/pass-tomb https://github.com/roddhjav/pass-tomb [1] https://www.dyne.org/software/tomb/ https://www.dyne.org/software/tomb/
- ayushnix 5y ago
  Besides pass-tomb, there's also pass-coffin which doesn't need to rely on a 3k+ line ZSH script. I'll add support for using age and signify in pass-coffin soon. https://github.com/ayushnix/pass-coffin https://github.com/ayushnix/pass-coffin
ayushnix 5y ago
FWIW, adding support for age in pass is listed as one of the goals of age. I'm considering sending an upstream patch in pass to support age and signify as well.

yepguy 5y ago

A few pass-related projects are working on an age[1] backend in addition to gpg. I think gopass already has support for it. [1]: https://age-encryption.org/ https://age-encryption.org/

zikduruqe 5y ago
Here's one I have been playing with success. https://github.com/chrisswanda/passage https://github.com/chrisswanda/passage
tex0 5y ago
Correct. Gopass has very early age support. It fully works but the UX is not great (yet).
- pqb 5y ago
  Oh dammit. I have stopped using Gopass and rewrote pass just for that reason - missing AGE encryption. At least I have learned something new and I feel I have better UI - fuzzy finder instead of their TUI. However, big kudos to Gopass team for awesome work and really useful tool. Before I start working on next project... Do you recognize any mobile app, which could replace PasswordStore app for Android [0] but with AGE support? [0]: https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-Store https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-S...
  - yepguy 5y ago
    Android Password Store itself is keen to add age support[1], but I don't know of anything usable right now. You could probably use gopass in termux in the mean time. [1]: https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-Store/issues/1195#issuecomment-808940598 https://github.com/android-password-store/Android-Password-S...
    - pqb 5y ago
      Oh, that's an awesome news. Thank you!
  - cobby 5y ago
    > missing AGE encryption I am just curious. What makes AGE backend better than GPG one?
    - yepguy 5y ago
      Age is much simpler to use in nearly every way, whether that's interactively (keys are just files!), in scripting, or in implementation. I'm still sticking to gpg for the foreseeable future, but between age and sequoia[1] I'm hopeful that things will soon be much easier to use. [1]: https://sequoia-pgp.org/ https://sequoia-pgp.org/
    - pqb 5y ago
      As yepguy mentioned AGE is simpler. I can also mention few things: - It works smoothly with SSH keys (generated from ssh-keygen), which are perfectly recognized by possibly any developer. - No need for external client, such as GpgWin/Kleopatra for Windows. - Embed-able in Rust[0] and Go[1] (there are libraries), no need to call `gpg --decrypt ...` from the command line. - Encrypted files by pass and keys are smaller. I guess it is thanks to ecliptic-curve encryption. [0]: https://github.com/str4d/rage https://github.com/str4d/rage [1]: https://github.com/FiloSottile/age https://github.com/FiloSottile/age

HotHotLava 5y ago

As a user, I also often feel like `gpg` brings a lot of annoying accidental complexity to `pass`, (like the need to "ultimately trust" keys before they become usable) but on the other hand it enables integration with hardware tokens like Yubikeys and in extension mobile devices (via openkeychain) that as far as I know wouldn't be possible with a more modern age-based backend.

beagle3 5y ago
SSH has included file encryption for a few versions now, and iirc supports yubikeys — probably would be more useful a backend than age.
- tialaramex 5y ago
  > SSH has included file encryption for a few versions now Mmm. I don't think so. Recent OpenSSH includes file signatures not encryption.
  - beagle3 5y ago
    Ahh, you are correct, I misremembered.
_abox 5y ago
Yep the integration with Yubikey is amazing. Both on mobile and desktop <3
yepguy 5y ago
https://github.com/str4d/age-plugin-yubikey https://github.com/str4d/age-plugin-yubikey
upofadown 5y ago
>like the need to "ultimately trust" keys before they become usable Did you have to do that manually at one time? All the keypairs that I make start out that way when created. When creating a keypair for pass all you have to do is generate the key using defaults while remembering a bit of the user ID to give to pass.

rank0 5y ago

I get what you’re saying but it’s just different philosophies no? Seems like pass wants to use the Unix philosophy of “do one thing well” so it relies on gpg for encryption instead of rolling its own.

vngzs 5y ago

Besides that, pass leaks metadata. If your passwords are the only part of your password manager you think are secret, then you're probably not considering the utility of an enumeration of all your network handles. Mine aren't very interesting, but I wouldn't post that on GitHub, even in a private repo. I love pass and use it. But when I need to carry my password database around, I don't rely on pass alone - I throw the pass database in a Veracrypt container. That way if my flash drive is stolen, it's just an encrypted blob.

karlding 5y ago
There's also the pass-tomb extension [0] which stores the directory in a tomb [1]. [0] https://github.com/roddhjav/pass-tomb https://github.com/roddhjav/pass-tomb [1] https://www.dyne.org/software/tomb/ https://www.dyne.org/software/tomb/
ayushnix 5y ago
Besides pass-tomb, there's also pass-coffin which doesn't need to rely on a 3k+ line ZSH script. I'll add support for using age and signify in pass-coffin soon. https://github.com/ayushnix/pass-coffin https://github.com/ayushnix/pass-coffin

ayushnix 5y ago

FWIW, adding support for age in pass is listed as one of the goals of age. I'm considering sending an upstream patch in pass to support age and signify as well.