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Are there any advantages of a cargo bike, compared to a ordinary bycicle and a trailer? Because I see none. My e-bike is a normal bike all the time and if I ma

Are there any advantages of a cargo bike, compared to a ordinary bycicle and a trailer? Because I see none. My e-bike is a normal bike all the time and if I make a tour with the kids or shop a bit more, I just attach the trailer and seem to have the best of both worlds.

wheels 5y ago
Cargo bikes are more effective as a yuppie status symbol. It shows, "I could have spent this much on a car, but I chose to spend it on a bike instead." Honestly, I don't really get it. I have a €50 used bike, a €100 used bike trailer, and for that matter, a €3000 used car, and don't see where a €1500 cargo bike, or €4000 e-Cargo Bike would bring into that mix. I regularly haul stuff in my bike trailer too. (And in the winter months, where it's dark, cold and wet, I just fall back on my damn car. I use it so little that I only have to fill up the 20L tank about once every 3 months.)
- jdavis703 5y ago
  The price of a good electric cargo bike is still way cheaper than a fairly decent used car. That said, a cargo bike seems like there’s less fussiness if you’re routinely hauling cargo (kids, groceries, etc). With a regular bike you’re going to be reconfiguring panniers, back seats, etc.
  - wheels 5y ago
    My 9 year old Hyundai i10 with 30k km and no accidents on it cost €3200. I'd call that "fairly decent". That's less than an electric cargo bike costs.
- phatfish 5y ago
  As a "yuppie" status symbol it has to be the least offensive I can think of. Better a fancy electric bike than some obnoxiously big SUV, or sporty-off-road thing that has never even seen grass.
  - wheels 5y ago
    I think where that analogy breaks down some is that this is mostly about what's happening in urban Europe, where SUVs and off-road vehicles are exceedingly rare. They're so rare that you notice them on the odd occasion of passing one (for me maybe every few weeks?) and I don't know anyone who has one.
    - fulafel 5y ago
      SUVs are common in urban Europe now. This doesn't differentiate between urban and other places but 40% overall means it's quite a lot in cities too, which matches my experience: https://www.acea.auto/figure/new-passenger-cars-by-segment-in-eu/ https://www.acea.auto/figure/new-passenger-cars-by-segment-i...
- usrusr 5y ago
  It's basically the same mechanism that made Tesla succeed with early BEVs where others failed: if the 4000€ e-cargo was a Model S the trailer would be a VW Citystromer. Another factor is that plenty of people permit themselves to go electric with a cargo bike who wouldn't dare getting seen on a regular bike with assist. "I'm not that old!". I believe that plenty of people have eventually caught themselves making up excuses why this particular ride could maybe require the load capacity (and chances are they were amused by it that's how deep the positive associations go). And lastly, while things like https://schokofahrt.de/ https://schokofahrt.de/ would certainly be possible with trailers (I'd actually be surprised if trailers have never been part of it), it's just not part of the brand.
- fulafel 5y ago
  The quoted thought could equally well fit unto a environmentally conscious person's thought bubble. But better to do it for status reasons than not at all as long as it displaces car use. (Also you can spend much less than that on a e-cargo bike, especially if you go used and/or fit your own ebike kit, eg put a simple bafang front drive on a used christiania or bakfiets bike)
- jamil7 5y ago
  You’re not factoring in the petrol, maintenance and parking cost of that €3k car so I don’t feel it’s really a status symbol, it is pretty practical. Costs aside I literally don’t have anywhere to park a car. A cargo bike I can manage. I agree if you’ve already got a bike trailer it probably doesn’t bring much to the table though.
bryanrasmussen 5y ago
A friend of mine said the Nihola that they used had better balance and was more maneuverable than a bike with a trailer, but also better than other cargo bikes so not sure how much better in each case.
fulafel 5y ago
Cargo bikes work better for heavier loads, most trailers seem to be ~30 kg whereas cargo bikes do 100-200 kg. And I wouldn't want to have that much on a trailer because of what happens when braking when towing a brakeless load on a wobbly arm that's heavier than the tractor. Trailers also bounce around a lot when empty at any speed and can fall over if you're eg crossing a curb while cornering.
- ip26 5y ago
  This is a good reminder, I've jackknifed with a kid trailer fully loaded under emergency braking. They laughed, of course. (your rear wheel gets light and the trailer pushes it to the side)
Someone 5y ago
One advantage is that a cargo bike is more social; you can keep eye contact with and talk with your kids.
ip26 5y ago
I'm not an evangelist, but it's easier to load kids, and when kids are over three years old even the roomiest of trailers get cramped. In warm weather, riding on the back is really fun for the kids. The trailer is better for foul weather, ice, and frigid cold, and really little kids. Cheaper, as you say. More of a hassle. Neither option is bad. But I don't regret the cargo bike when I remember how excited the kids are to ride it.
jasone 5y ago
Yes, the cargo bike is much better for transporting children, for the simple reason that the children are suspended on the same wheels as the rider. Kid trailers have two wheels, typically of smaller diameter than normal bicycle wheels. That's a double-whammy, because the trailer wheels don't follow the same track (they hit potholes the rider doesn't feel), and the impacts are harder due to reduced wheel diameter. Trailer suspension does not solve these problems. Aside from child hauling, trailers are harder to manage, assuming the load can instead be put directly on the bike. I put over 7,000 miles on a Surly Big Dummy, much of it hauling my son from age <1 to 7. It was far safer and more comfortable for him than a trailer would have been. I've also ridden thousands of miles with a B.O.B. cargo trailer and a Tout Terrain trailer, and I would always choose the cargo bike if at all suitable to the conditions. The only thing I prefer the trailer for is hauling gear for trail maintenance.
- acomjean 5y ago
  for those slightly confused "Surly Big Dummy" Surly is a bike brand in the US. Big Dummy: The bike model (clearly with bad AI). https://surlybikes.com/bikes/big_dummy https://surlybikes.com/bikes/big_dummy
takk309 5y ago
The center of mass of a loaded cargo bike is lower than a normal bike with load. This makes them more rideable with large loads, especially if the load shifts a bit during transport, like a child that can unexpectedly move off balance.
jagermo 5y ago
I switched from bike/trailer to cargobike. First, I prefer to have the kids in front of me. I can see them and, more important, I can make sure that there is nothing sticking out onto the street, beeing mowed down by a car. Second, I feel the cargobike is more compact. Yes, it is long, but not as long as a bike plus trailer. Third, cars react differently to you, at least that's how i feel. Especially the bigger cars and SUVs don't try to cut you off as often as with a bike - probably because they think a crash could do way more damage. But it depends. We don't own a car (because the traffic situation is really shitty and i start cursing whenever i have to drive) and the cargobike has turned into our daily driver (ha!), not only for the kids but also for shopping or just for getting from point a to b. But if the trailer works for you, no need to switch. Different preferences, i'd say.

wheels 5y ago

Cargo bikes are more effective as a yuppie status symbol. It shows, "I could have spent this much on a car, but I chose to spend it on a bike instead." Honestly, I don't really get it. I have a €50 used bike, a €100 used bike trailer, and for that matter, a €3000 used car, and don't see where a €1500 cargo bike, or €4000 e-Cargo Bike would bring into that mix. I regularly haul stuff in my bike trailer too. (And in the winter months, where it's dark, cold and wet, I just fall back on my damn car. I use it so little that I only have to fill up the 20L tank about once every 3 months.)

jdavis703 5y ago
The price of a good electric cargo bike is still way cheaper than a fairly decent used car. That said, a cargo bike seems like there’s less fussiness if you’re routinely hauling cargo (kids, groceries, etc). With a regular bike you’re going to be reconfiguring panniers, back seats, etc.
- wheels 5y ago
  My 9 year old Hyundai i10 with 30k km and no accidents on it cost €3200. I'd call that "fairly decent". That's less than an electric cargo bike costs.
phatfish 5y ago
As a "yuppie" status symbol it has to be the least offensive I can think of. Better a fancy electric bike than some obnoxiously big SUV, or sporty-off-road thing that has never even seen grass.
- wheels 5y ago
  I think where that analogy breaks down some is that this is mostly about what's happening in urban Europe, where SUVs and off-road vehicles are exceedingly rare. They're so rare that you notice them on the odd occasion of passing one (for me maybe every few weeks?) and I don't know anyone who has one.
  - fulafel 5y ago
    SUVs are common in urban Europe now. This doesn't differentiate between urban and other places but 40% overall means it's quite a lot in cities too, which matches my experience: https://www.acea.auto/figure/new-passenger-cars-by-segment-in-eu/ https://www.acea.auto/figure/new-passenger-cars-by-segment-i...
usrusr 5y ago
It's basically the same mechanism that made Tesla succeed with early BEVs where others failed: if the 4000€ e-cargo was a Model S the trailer would be a VW Citystromer. Another factor is that plenty of people permit themselves to go electric with a cargo bike who wouldn't dare getting seen on a regular bike with assist. "I'm not that old!". I believe that plenty of people have eventually caught themselves making up excuses why this particular ride could maybe require the load capacity (and chances are they were amused by it that's how deep the positive associations go). And lastly, while things like https://schokofahrt.de/ https://schokofahrt.de/ would certainly be possible with trailers (I'd actually be surprised if trailers have never been part of it), it's just not part of the brand.
fulafel 5y ago
The quoted thought could equally well fit unto a environmentally conscious person's thought bubble. But better to do it for status reasons than not at all as long as it displaces car use. (Also you can spend much less than that on a e-cargo bike, especially if you go used and/or fit your own ebike kit, eg put a simple bafang front drive on a used christiania or bakfiets bike)
jamil7 5y ago
You’re not factoring in the petrol, maintenance and parking cost of that €3k car so I don’t feel it’s really a status symbol, it is pretty practical. Costs aside I literally don’t have anywhere to park a car. A cargo bike I can manage. I agree if you’ve already got a bike trailer it probably doesn’t bring much to the table though.

bryanrasmussen 5y ago

A friend of mine said the Nihola that they used had better balance and was more maneuverable than a bike with a trailer, but also better than other cargo bikes so not sure how much better in each case.

fulafel 5y ago

Cargo bikes work better for heavier loads, most trailers seem to be ~30 kg whereas cargo bikes do 100-200 kg. And I wouldn't want to have that much on a trailer because of what happens when braking when towing a brakeless load on a wobbly arm that's heavier than the tractor. Trailers also bounce around a lot when empty at any speed and can fall over if you're eg crossing a curb while cornering.

ip26 5y ago
This is a good reminder, I've jackknifed with a kid trailer fully loaded under emergency braking. They laughed, of course. (your rear wheel gets light and the trailer pushes it to the side)

Someone 5y ago

One advantage is that a cargo bike is more social; you can keep eye contact with and talk with your kids.

ip26 5y ago

I'm not an evangelist, but it's easier to load kids, and when kids are over three years old even the roomiest of trailers get cramped. In warm weather, riding on the back is really fun for the kids. The trailer is better for foul weather, ice, and frigid cold, and really little kids. Cheaper, as you say. More of a hassle. Neither option is bad. But I don't regret the cargo bike when I remember how excited the kids are to ride it.

jasone 5y ago

Yes, the cargo bike is much better for transporting children, for the simple reason that the children are suspended on the same wheels as the rider. Kid trailers have two wheels, typically of smaller diameter than normal bicycle wheels. That's a double-whammy, because the trailer wheels don't follow the same track (they hit potholes the rider doesn't feel), and the impacts are harder due to reduced wheel diameter. Trailer suspension does not solve these problems. Aside from child hauling, trailers are harder to manage, assuming the load can instead be put directly on the bike. I put over 7,000 miles on a Surly Big Dummy, much of it hauling my son from age <1 to 7. It was far safer and more comfortable for him than a trailer would have been. I've also ridden thousands of miles with a B.O.B. cargo trailer and a Tout Terrain trailer, and I would always choose the cargo bike if at all suitable to the conditions. The only thing I prefer the trailer for is hauling gear for trail maintenance.

acomjean 5y ago
for those slightly confused "Surly Big Dummy" Surly is a bike brand in the US. Big Dummy: The bike model (clearly with bad AI). https://surlybikes.com/bikes/big_dummy https://surlybikes.com/bikes/big_dummy

takk309 5y ago

The center of mass of a loaded cargo bike is lower than a normal bike with load. This makes them more rideable with large loads, especially if the load shifts a bit during transport, like a child that can unexpectedly move off balance.

jagermo 5y ago

I switched from bike/trailer to cargobike. First, I prefer to have the kids in front of me. I can see them and, more important, I can make sure that there is nothing sticking out onto the street, beeing mowed down by a car. Second, I feel the cargobike is more compact. Yes, it is long, but not as long as a bike plus trailer. Third, cars react differently to you, at least that's how i feel. Especially the bigger cars and SUVs don't try to cut you off as often as with a bike - probably because they think a crash could do way more damage. But it depends. We don't own a car (because the traffic situation is really shitty and i start cursing whenever i have to drive) and the cargobike has turned into our daily driver (ha!), not only for the kids but also for shopping or just for getting from point a to b. But if the trailer works for you, no need to switch. Different preferences, i'd say.