3 ms·

I actually thought nextstep looked really ugly even back in the day. I really dislike the icon styles for some reason with so much grey. Looks really dated (and

I actually thought nextstep looked really ugly even back in the day. I really dislike the icon styles for some reason with so much grey. Looks really dated (and I can remember thinking that when it was out!).

mromanuk 5y ago
Yes, when I started using Linux in ‘99, several desktop UIs imitated this style. And it looked dated and ugly to me, compared to Windows 95, KDE and Gnome.
- microtonal 5y ago
  KDE in 1999: https://czechia.kde.org/screenshots/images/medium/matthiase1.jpg https://czechia.kde.org/screenshots/images/medium/matthiase1... GNOME in 1999: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/GNOME_1.0_%281999%2C_03%29_with_GNOME_Panel_1_and_File_Manager.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/GNOME_1.... Of course, it's a matter of taste, but GNOME and KDE looked pretty bad back then. If I had the money, I'd definitely preferred NeXTSTEP. It's just so much cleaner and better thought-out. This is what it looked like in the early 90ies: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NeXTSTEP#/media/File:NeXTSTEP_desktop.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NeXTSTEP#/media/File:NeXTSTEP_... BTW, this is what NeXTSTEP looked like in 2000 (Mac OS X public beta): https://512pixels.net/projects/aqua-screenshot-library/mac-os-x-public-beta-kodiak/#jp-carousel-15269 https://512pixels.net/projects/aqua-screenshot-library/mac-o... I love NeXTSTEP, because it was awesome for its time, but I greatly prefer the latest macOS :).
  - daoismyname 5y ago
    > Of course, it's a matter of taste, but GNOME and KDE looked pretty bad back then. If I had the money, I'd definitely preferred NeXTSTEP can confirm That's the reason why I was using Window Maker back then
  - mromanuk 5y ago
    Yes, the Aqua treatment made it leap forward. I love that aged Gnome style :) Met too, I use MacOS and it's the best UI since 20 years ago.
SeanLuke 5y ago
> Looks really dated (and I can remember thinking that when it was out!). NeXTSTEP (v0.8) was "out" in 1989. It looked like this: http://toastytech.com/guis/ns08.html http://toastytech.com/guis/ns08.html Whereas Windows in 1989 looked like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_2.1x https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_2.1x And Mac OS looked like this: https://apple.fandom.com/wiki/System_6.0.4 https://apple.fandom.com/wiki/System_6.0.4 I think you might be misremembering.
- martinald 5y ago
  I don't mean "out" as in first release date, I mean "out" as in it was currently being updated at the time. You're right on Win2.x and System6, but later versions of Win & Mac both looked better to me.
  - SeanLuke 5y ago
    Well, let's look at that. The very last version of NeXTSTEP was 4.x, and was released in 1996 near the end of NeXT's life. It was basically identical in looks to 3.x. Here are some screenshots of 3.x: https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3a4e284a2ef/a4664c85-5c98-11e9-9db4-fa163e9022f0 https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3... https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3a4e284a2ef/b0518bd6-5c98-11e9-9db4-fa163e9022f0 https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3... https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3a4e284a2ef/bb5ab60f-5c98-11e9-9db4-fa163e9022f0 https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3... Some shots of NeXTSTEP 4.2. https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/openstep42 https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/openstep42 Windows was of course presently on Windows 95. Interestingly, both Windows 95 and OS/2 had largely copied NeXTSTEP design elements, including its famous "3D" look and feel, but even little things, like the popup corner menu, practically identical close and minimize (er, maximize) icons, etc., but with a much worse graphics subsystem, and terrible fonts and icons compared to NeXT. https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/win95 https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/win95 MacOS was not quite on version 8 yet but let's round it up. It too had copied design elements from NeXTSTEP, and likewise had a much cruder graphics subsystem with terrible fonts and icons in comparison. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_8 Beauty is in the eye of the beholder of course. Windows and MacOS had caught up somewhat by then. But I think it's pretty incredible to seriously say that Windows or MacOS were ever better looking (or functioning) than NeXTSTEP, at least up until NeXT was bought by Apple and NeXTSTEP ceased to exist as a product. Heck, neither 95 nor MacOS 8 even had live window dragging, something NeXTSTEP had in 1989.
mattowen_uk 5y ago
I have a theory that NeXTStep is so grey, is because high resolution monitors with sharp text were only really affordable in monochrome. So the theming originally leant into that.

mromanuk 5y ago

Yes, when I started using Linux in ‘99, several desktop UIs imitated this style. And it looked dated and ugly to me, compared to Windows 95, KDE and Gnome.

microtonal 5y ago
KDE in 1999: https://czechia.kde.org/screenshots/images/medium/matthiase1.jpg https://czechia.kde.org/screenshots/images/medium/matthiase1... GNOME in 1999: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/GNOME_1.0_%281999%2C_03%29_with_GNOME_Panel_1_and_File_Manager.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/GNOME_1.... Of course, it's a matter of taste, but GNOME and KDE looked pretty bad back then. If I had the money, I'd definitely preferred NeXTSTEP. It's just so much cleaner and better thought-out. This is what it looked like in the early 90ies: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NeXTSTEP#/media/File:NeXTSTEP_desktop.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NeXTSTEP#/media/File:NeXTSTEP_... BTW, this is what NeXTSTEP looked like in 2000 (Mac OS X public beta): https://512pixels.net/projects/aqua-screenshot-library/mac-os-x-public-beta-kodiak/#jp-carousel-15269 https://512pixels.net/projects/aqua-screenshot-library/mac-o... I love NeXTSTEP, because it was awesome for its time, but I greatly prefer the latest macOS :).
- daoismyname 5y ago
  > Of course, it's a matter of taste, but GNOME and KDE looked pretty bad back then. If I had the money, I'd definitely preferred NeXTSTEP can confirm That's the reason why I was using Window Maker back then
- mromanuk 5y ago
  Yes, the Aqua treatment made it leap forward. I love that aged Gnome style :) Met too, I use MacOS and it's the best UI since 20 years ago.

SeanLuke 5y ago

> Looks really dated (and I can remember thinking that when it was out!). NeXTSTEP (v0.8) was "out" in 1989. It looked like this: http://toastytech.com/guis/ns08.html http://toastytech.com/guis/ns08.html Whereas Windows in 1989 looked like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_2.1x https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_2.1x And Mac OS looked like this: https://apple.fandom.com/wiki/System_6.0.4 https://apple.fandom.com/wiki/System_6.0.4 I think you might be misremembering.

martinald 5y ago
I don't mean "out" as in first release date, I mean "out" as in it was currently being updated at the time. You're right on Win2.x and System6, but later versions of Win & Mac both looked better to me.
- SeanLuke 5y ago
  Well, let's look at that. The very last version of NeXTSTEP was 4.x, and was released in 1996 near the end of NeXT's life. It was basically identical in looks to 3.x. Here are some screenshots of 3.x: https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3a4e284a2ef/a4664c85-5c98-11e9-9db4-fa163e9022f0 https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3... https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3a4e284a2ef/b0518bd6-5c98-11e9-9db4-fa163e9022f0 https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3... https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3a4e284a2ef/bb5ab60f-5c98-11e9-9db4-fa163e9022f0 https://winworldpc.com/screenshot/53c394c2-abc2-ab26-5111-c3... Some shots of NeXTSTEP 4.2. https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/openstep42 https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/openstep42 Windows was of course presently on Windows 95. Interestingly, both Windows 95 and OS/2 had largely copied NeXTSTEP design elements, including its famous "3D" look and feel, but even little things, like the popup corner menu, practically identical close and minimize (er, maximize) icons, etc., but with a much worse graphics subsystem, and terrible fonts and icons compared to NeXT. https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/win95 https://guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/win95 MacOS was not quite on version 8 yet but let's round it up. It too had copied design elements from NeXTSTEP, and likewise had a much cruder graphics subsystem with terrible fonts and icons in comparison. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS_8 Beauty is in the eye of the beholder of course. Windows and MacOS had caught up somewhat by then. But I think it's pretty incredible to seriously say that Windows or MacOS were ever better looking (or functioning) than NeXTSTEP, at least up until NeXT was bought by Apple and NeXTSTEP ceased to exist as a product. Heck, neither 95 nor MacOS 8 even had live window dragging, something NeXTSTEP had in 1989.

mattowen_uk 5y ago

I have a theory that NeXTStep is so grey, is because high resolution monitors with sharp text were only really affordable in monochrome. So the theming originally leant into that.