4 ms·

Fair, but let's say they sent everyone home and 3 of the people died in their homes from the tornado. Would we be outraged that the company sent them home in s

Fair, but let's say they sent everyone home and 3 of the people died in their homes from the tornado. Would we be outraged that the company sent them home in such foul weather?

spacecadet 5y ago
I think there is no win for the business or the families in any of the outcomes. We know so little about what the Business actually knew and what type of protection or preference these individuals had in the moment. I also think any reasoning about a solution is not making space for the individuals who lost their lives. The number of comments and how quickly this is moving off the first page of HN speaks volumes about the sentiment of the this community.
themaninthedark 5y ago
Down thread someone lists the average tornado warning time as 9 minutes. With 9 minutes warning, most people would be just getting to their cars with some still on the plant floor getting their stuff to go home. They had 20 minutes per the article, in that time frame you would have a traffic jam in the parking lot as everyone tried to leave down the 2 lane road that services the factory.
- MrStonedOne 5y ago
  Playing fast and loose here with warning definitions. They had 2 days warning. not 20 minutes.
  - themaninthedark 5y ago
    They had 2 day warning that the weather system was likely to produce tornadoes. Comment say that Mayfield had about 2.5 hours of warning based on this blog: https://cliffmass.blogspot.com/2021/12/a-critical-gap-in-tornado-warning.html?m=1 https://cliffmass.blogspot.com/2021/12/a-critical-gap-in-tor... If you look at the area encompassed by the tornado watch, should they have evacuated it in it's entirety? https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEji0sqQJqWoAwe9rODyi4NfOkGdcAHwXrqG4WGlX9S22VZp_kKQI3vx2yrVAvI8MCmyVE6bGUALREgpMLo8pEyfw6PWhpjWawDLhWNnhMphquNc_i6wL-G_6NucN0fxTmxGubmBwQP1YjA8syn2mQcOPCf6L55zMTxxzMCdPB_0fPuLOpC6fOtssQA0=s1140 https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEji0sqQJqWo... Look about 300mi x 170mi area. If you take Jones burro as the center, its 120mi to the edge, technically if everyone could evacuate at 60mph you could get everyone out in 2 hours.... but with NWS tornado warnings have a False Alarm Rate (FAR) of roughly 70% you probably won't get that many people to evacuate at all unless you make it mandatory. Then it will take much longer than 2 hours to get people out. You are talking about massive areas with small amounts of time: https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEhcPxy7gbyruPRvRpRf3x7zQ4ZaUWhAmVIcMzQSB1GHP4WictUICuT8R3OyM2Bc1S2QNAM1D2w0x4NyYaYMQEfFMUqXekRbN9L4RAl4OctlijmXFxvMK1ho-Us3eqJaEz9OAmNpDvTB4KjPkO7HkBfgBKr9LR0oF7f5X6492SQuO9aF_a0129710lpM=s1020 https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEhcPxy7gbyr... is roughly 430 square miles for something that is small and fast moving.
    - MrStonedOne 5y ago
      What? I'm not talking about evacuating people... I'm talking about not forcing them to come in to work for a 3rd shift overnight run that can most definitely be delayed by a shift for a weather pattern known to create high numbers of tornadoes.
    - selimthegrim 5y ago
      As that comment corrected that was more like 20 min (time zone wise)

Fair, but let's say they sent everyone home and 3 of the people died in their homes from the tornado. Would we be outraged that the company sent them home in such foul weather?

spacecadet 5y ago

I think there is no win for the business or the families in any of the outcomes. We know so little about what the Business actually knew and what type of protection or preference these individuals had in the moment. I also think any reasoning about a solution is not making space for the individuals who lost their lives. The number of comments and how quickly this is moving off the first page of HN speaks volumes about the sentiment of the this community.

themaninthedark 5y ago

Down thread someone lists the average tornado warning time as 9 minutes. With 9 minutes warning, most people would be just getting to their cars with some still on the plant floor getting their stuff to go home. They had 20 minutes per the article, in that time frame you would have a traffic jam in the parking lot as everyone tried to leave down the 2 lane road that services the factory.

MrStonedOne 5y ago
Playing fast and loose here with warning definitions. They had 2 days warning. not 20 minutes.
- themaninthedark 5y ago
  They had 2 day warning that the weather system was likely to produce tornadoes. Comment say that Mayfield had about 2.5 hours of warning based on this blog: https://cliffmass.blogspot.com/2021/12/a-critical-gap-in-tornado-warning.html?m=1 https://cliffmass.blogspot.com/2021/12/a-critical-gap-in-tor... If you look at the area encompassed by the tornado watch, should they have evacuated it in it's entirety? https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEji0sqQJqWoAwe9rODyi4NfOkGdcAHwXrqG4WGlX9S22VZp_kKQI3vx2yrVAvI8MCmyVE6bGUALREgpMLo8pEyfw6PWhpjWawDLhWNnhMphquNc_i6wL-G_6NucN0fxTmxGubmBwQP1YjA8syn2mQcOPCf6L55zMTxxzMCdPB_0fPuLOpC6fOtssQA0=s1140 https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEji0sqQJqWo... Look about 300mi x 170mi area. If you take Jones burro as the center, its 120mi to the edge, technically if everyone could evacuate at 60mph you could get everyone out in 2 hours.... but with NWS tornado warnings have a False Alarm Rate (FAR) of roughly 70% you probably won't get that many people to evacuate at all unless you make it mandatory. Then it will take much longer than 2 hours to get people out. You are talking about massive areas with small amounts of time: https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEhcPxy7gbyruPRvRpRf3x7zQ4ZaUWhAmVIcMzQSB1GHP4WictUICuT8R3OyM2Bc1S2QNAM1D2w0x4NyYaYMQEfFMUqXekRbN9L4RAl4OctlijmXFxvMK1ho-Us3eqJaEz9OAmNpDvTB4KjPkO7HkBfgBKr9LR0oF7f5X6492SQuO9aF_a0129710lpM=s1020 https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/a/AVvXsEhcPxy7gbyr... is roughly 430 square miles for something that is small and fast moving.
  - MrStonedOne 5y ago
    What? I'm not talking about evacuating people... I'm talking about not forcing them to come in to work for a 3rd shift overnight run that can most definitely be delayed by a shift for a weather pattern known to create high numbers of tornadoes.
  - selimthegrim 5y ago
    As that comment corrected that was more like 20 min (time zone wise)