6 ms·

It reminds me of the short story "Manna – Two Views of Humanity’s Future" [1], which describes the steady establishment of AI process optimizers as the managers

by ghgr 5y ago

It reminds me of the short story "Manna – Two Views of Humanity’s Future" [1], which describes the steady establishment of AI process optimizers as the managers of human employees, who increasingly became a replaceable commodity. Fascinating read. [1] https://marshallbrain.com/manna1 https://marshallbrain.com/manna1

AussieWog93 5y ago
Funny you mention that. I've felt the same thing when going on Uber Eats runs with my mate who drives for them. At the moment, the technology is in the "chapter 1" stage where things are pretty smooth and chill. It's genuinely low-stress, well-paced work. Once self-driving tech hits the market, though, it's clear that the human employees will be replaced without a care or thought for their well-being.
- hellbannedguy 5y ago
  Not if they unionize, and it's hard to offshore delivery drivers. I guess autonomous driving cars will be an option?
- retube 5y ago
  So? Ever since the industrial revolution new technology has obsoleted jobs. 98% of us used to be farmers. Excel put gazillions of book-keepers out of work. But we're still at basically full employment: there's thousands of jobs now no one could have conceived of 50 years ago, or even 20 years ago. Self-driving cars (if indeed they actually materialise) will be hugely transformative for society, and create whole new businesses and industries, i.e. new jobs to replace the old. Progress fundamentally relies on this "creative destruction", without it we'd still be in caves scavenging for nuts and berries. Edit: it's kind of bonkers that pointing out the basic mechanics of technological progress is getting downvoted on a site like HN, where I imagine most of us are gainfully employed trying to do just this.
  - credittw2021 5y ago
    Otoh the last few decades have led to automation replacing well paying jobs with mcJobs.
    - retube 5y ago
      Maybe in some localised areas. Globally tho absolutely not; in recent years huge numbers of people have been pulled into the middle classes, probably a 1bn+ in India and China, and Africa is now the fastest growing economy, with the world bank expecting most countries to reach "middle income" status by 2025.
    - JoachimS 5y ago
      And replacing entry level academic jobs with machines - adding a barrier of entry for freshly baked lawyers.
  - derekjdanserl 5y ago
    >So? So much for humanity benefitting from technology. Instead of our workdays becoming fewer and shorter, a tiny number of people who don’t work at all will become richer while our lives become more alienated from our labor. This is the opposite of what we tell each other technology is supposed to accomplish. If it’s not a problem, why do we keep lying about?
    - FDSGSG 5y ago
      You are describing some speculative future that doesn't really correlate with historical progress. Same could've been said about the industrial revolution, but somehow it did end up dramatically benefitting all of humanity.
      - nopenopenopeno 5y ago
        Again, that is the story we well, but it’s a very reckless claim. Generations in early industrialization who still remembered life as a peasant almost universally preferred life as a peasant. Industrialization’s need for labor forced other peasants from their land to build competing modern nation states. Very few people asked for this and only a small wealthy few would tell you that dragging these people into brutal toiling factory labor improved everybody’s lives, but those are the people who funded the history books.
JoachimS 5y ago
Good pointer, and a good short story.
mikro2nd 5y ago
When I first read Dune, 'lo those many years ago, I always thought of the Butlerian Jihad as being somewhere in our far future. Now, I'm not so sure...
- pessimizer 5y ago
  When I first read it, I realized was probably a Butlerian jihadist. "Computers" are unfortunately named after the least important thing that they do (accounting.) What's important about them is that they are allow us to generalize and add infinite complexity to autonomous control systems, like valves that open when a certain pressure is reached, or switches that toggle at a certain light level. The ultimate computer network would keep the king that implemented it in power for eternity, even after his death, by keeping his will alive. If you automated his corpse, you wouldn't even need to know that the king could die. edit: "Ordenador" (from Spain) is probably better, i.e the thing/person that gives orders, or puts things in order. Maybe "mandónador"...
monkeybutton 5y ago
I've been seeing more and more references to this story over the last few years which is a sign.. Of something. It would be really interesting to see the Http referrer logs his website gets for it. Probably a great collection of threads about everywhere this kind of automation is happening.

by ghgr 5y ago

AussieWog93 5y ago

Funny you mention that. I've felt the same thing when going on Uber Eats runs with my mate who drives for them. At the moment, the technology is in the "chapter 1" stage where things are pretty smooth and chill. It's genuinely low-stress, well-paced work. Once self-driving tech hits the market, though, it's clear that the human employees will be replaced without a care or thought for their well-being.

hellbannedguy 5y ago
Not if they unionize, and it's hard to offshore delivery drivers. I guess autonomous driving cars will be an option?
retube 5y ago
So? Ever since the industrial revolution new technology has obsoleted jobs. 98% of us used to be farmers. Excel put gazillions of book-keepers out of work. But we're still at basically full employment: there's thousands of jobs now no one could have conceived of 50 years ago, or even 20 years ago. Self-driving cars (if indeed they actually materialise) will be hugely transformative for society, and create whole new businesses and industries, i.e. new jobs to replace the old. Progress fundamentally relies on this "creative destruction", without it we'd still be in caves scavenging for nuts and berries. Edit: it's kind of bonkers that pointing out the basic mechanics of technological progress is getting downvoted on a site like HN, where I imagine most of us are gainfully employed trying to do just this.
- credittw2021 5y ago
  Otoh the last few decades have led to automation replacing well paying jobs with mcJobs.
  - retube 5y ago
    Maybe in some localised areas. Globally tho absolutely not; in recent years huge numbers of people have been pulled into the middle classes, probably a 1bn+ in India and China, and Africa is now the fastest growing economy, with the world bank expecting most countries to reach "middle income" status by 2025.
  - JoachimS 5y ago
    And replacing entry level academic jobs with machines - adding a barrier of entry for freshly baked lawyers.
- derekjdanserl 5y ago
  >So? So much for humanity benefitting from technology. Instead of our workdays becoming fewer and shorter, a tiny number of people who don’t work at all will become richer while our lives become more alienated from our labor. This is the opposite of what we tell each other technology is supposed to accomplish. If it’s not a problem, why do we keep lying about?
  - FDSGSG 5y ago
    You are describing some speculative future that doesn't really correlate with historical progress. Same could've been said about the industrial revolution, but somehow it did end up dramatically benefitting all of humanity.
    - nopenopenopeno 5y ago
      Again, that is the story we well, but it’s a very reckless claim. Generations in early industrialization who still remembered life as a peasant almost universally preferred life as a peasant. Industrialization’s need for labor forced other peasants from their land to build competing modern nation states. Very few people asked for this and only a small wealthy few would tell you that dragging these people into brutal toiling factory labor improved everybody’s lives, but those are the people who funded the history books.

JoachimS 5y ago

Good pointer, and a good short story.

mikro2nd 5y ago

When I first read Dune, 'lo those many years ago, I always thought of the Butlerian Jihad as being somewhere in our far future. Now, I'm not so sure...

pessimizer 5y ago
When I first read it, I realized was probably a Butlerian jihadist. "Computers" are unfortunately named after the least important thing that they do (accounting.) What's important about them is that they are allow us to generalize and add infinite complexity to autonomous control systems, like valves that open when a certain pressure is reached, or switches that toggle at a certain light level. The ultimate computer network would keep the king that implemented it in power for eternity, even after his death, by keeping his will alive. If you automated his corpse, you wouldn't even need to know that the king could die. edit: "Ordenador" (from Spain) is probably better, i.e the thing/person that gives orders, or puts things in order. Maybe "mandónador"...

monkeybutton 5y ago

I've been seeing more and more references to this story over the last few years which is a sign.. Of something. It would be really interesting to see the Http referrer logs his website gets for it. Probably a great collection of threads about everywhere this kind of automation is happening.