3 ms·

"far right money-laundering" ... what? Is this a new conspiracy theory I'm not aware of?

brodo 5y ago
David Golumbia has written a book called “The Politics of Bitcoin - Software as Right-Wing Extremism” which goes into the connection between cryptocurrency and far-right ideology. Here is an interview with him: https://overcast.fm/+ZpQA7ciS0 https://overcast.fm/+ZpQA7ciS0
- sol_invictus 5y ago
  Any US personnel dependent on the academic system writing about anything remotely political or social sciences related (i.e. anything mathematically unverifiable) cannot be trusted as any kind of authority (in the current era). The rabid left-wing student organizations will destroy their livelihood on the smallest whim if their stance is "wrong".
Yizahi 5y ago
There was some recent news article about this. I think it is not unreasonable take, because obviously crypto is safer to use for fringe groups than Visa or Paypal. But I agree the wording is way too hysterical, that is a bad sign.
- samhw 5y ago
  I mean, 'money laundering' is a very different thing from 'using a different payment protocol because you've been banned from conventional ones'. I'm not at all right-wing, but it sets a dangerous precedent to establish 'acceptable' payment protocols run by the dominant monopolies, then ban people whom you don't like, and baselessly accuse them of 'money laundering' when they (obviously) go somewhere else.
- blueflow 5y ago
  I'm not from the anglosphere. Google does not spit out anything useful to me. What did happen? I still don't know what you are talking about.
  - lawtalkinghuman 5y ago
    Regarding this week's SPLC report: https://thehill.com/policy/technology/585306-bitcoin-surge-a-boon-for-white-nationalists-study https://thehill.com/policy/technology/585306-bitcoin-surge-a... https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/12/08/bitcoin-adoption-among-far-right-extremists-leaves-its-mark-on-the-blockchain/ https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/12/08/bitcoin-adoption-am... https://gizmodo.com/far-right-leaders-are-raking-in-millions-from-bitcoin-1848194734 https://gizmodo.com/far-right-leaders-are-raking-in-millions... A random sample of previous coverage: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/24/bitcoin-currency-far-right-neo-nazis-cryptocurrencies https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/24/bitcoi... https://apnews.com/article/capitol-siege-international-news-technology-suicides-france-1e36d9c422b097a16c44b3bf5c8c3f46 https://apnews.com/article/capitol-siege-international-news-... https://decrypt.co/80971/far-right-conspiracist-sent-60000-bitcoin-fund-legal-case https://decrypt.co/80971/far-right-conspiracist-sent-60000-b...
    - blueflow 5y ago
      The 6 articles you linked neither mention money laundering, nor describe something that qualifies (in my understanding) as money laundering.
      - lawtalkinghuman 5y ago
        The original post did not use money laundering in the legal sense but in the ordinary language use sense of the phrase.
        blueflow 5y ago
        Don't bullshit me, we both know it was written with defamatory intent, and it turned out its not substantiable. Its slander.
        tarboreus 5y ago
        ...which means what? This seems like an odd equivocation. Is money laundering the newest term to get a new, politically useful definition?
bko 5y ago
I think there's an idea that if someone is thought to have a certain set of beliefs they should be refused basic services such as the ability to store/transfer/receive value and the ability to earn a living. So if something enables them to have these basic services, it's a grave threat. According to the president of the US, the ideology is the deadliest threat to the US. So keeping money out of the hands of people thought to be sympathetic to the cause is vital. > "We won't ignore what our intelligence agencies have determined to be the most lethal terrorist threat to our homeland today: White supremacy is terrorism," Biden said. "We're not going to ignore that either." https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/white-supremacy-most-lethal-threat-to-america-biden-says/ar-BB1gaa5Q https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/white-supremacy-most...
- kamray23 5y ago
  It's not just far-right either. Cryptocurrency, despite its appearance of full traceability and transparency, provides an incredibly easy method for money laundering in the long term and has been used to do so by every side. Many communist countries utilize cryptocurrency to perform transactions outside international trade law, bypassing blockades and sanctions normally enforced by banks, foreign offices, and physical blockade. Criminals of course love the damn thing, hackers especially. The technology is good but it has so many bad uses that it's still a real ethical gray area for a lot of people. Not to mention the countless scams profiting off people who don't know any better and literally advertised and peddled by modern mass media.
  - selfhoster11 5y ago
    It's literally problems with cash, scaled up to the extent that they become a qualitatively new problem due to the sheer ease and low risk of shifting money. I wonder if it's even morally consistent to take the view they cash is fine, but cryptocurrency isn't.
  - ludamad 5y ago
    Cash seems a lot better for crime, except for international use. "There should be no international cash equivalent" - would you agree with this?

David Golumbia has written a book called “The Politics of Bitcoin - Software as Right-Wing Extremism” which goes into the connection between cryptocurrency and far-right ideology. Here is an interview with him: https://overcast.fm/+ZpQA7ciS0 https://overcast.fm/+ZpQA7ciS0

sol_invictus 5y ago
Any US personnel dependent on the academic system writing about anything remotely political or social sciences related (i.e. anything mathematically unverifiable) cannot be trusted as any kind of authority (in the current era). The rabid left-wing student organizations will destroy their livelihood on the smallest whim if their stance is "wrong".

Yizahi 5y ago

There was some recent news article about this. I think it is not unreasonable take, because obviously crypto is safer to use for fringe groups than Visa or Paypal. But I agree the wording is way too hysterical, that is a bad sign.

samhw 5y ago
I mean, 'money laundering' is a very different thing from 'using a different payment protocol because you've been banned from conventional ones'. I'm not at all right-wing, but it sets a dangerous precedent to establish 'acceptable' payment protocols run by the dominant monopolies, then ban people whom you don't like, and baselessly accuse them of 'money laundering' when they (obviously) go somewhere else.
blueflow 5y ago
I'm not from the anglosphere. Google does not spit out anything useful to me. What did happen? I still don't know what you are talking about.
- lawtalkinghuman 5y ago
  Regarding this week's SPLC report: https://thehill.com/policy/technology/585306-bitcoin-surge-a-boon-for-white-nationalists-study https://thehill.com/policy/technology/585306-bitcoin-surge-a... https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/12/08/bitcoin-adoption-among-far-right-extremists-leaves-its-mark-on-the-blockchain/ https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/12/08/bitcoin-adoption-am... https://gizmodo.com/far-right-leaders-are-raking-in-millions-from-bitcoin-1848194734 https://gizmodo.com/far-right-leaders-are-raking-in-millions... A random sample of previous coverage: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/24/bitcoin-currency-far-right-neo-nazis-cryptocurrencies https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/24/bitcoi... https://apnews.com/article/capitol-siege-international-news-technology-suicides-france-1e36d9c422b097a16c44b3bf5c8c3f46 https://apnews.com/article/capitol-siege-international-news-... https://decrypt.co/80971/far-right-conspiracist-sent-60000-bitcoin-fund-legal-case https://decrypt.co/80971/far-right-conspiracist-sent-60000-b...
  - blueflow 5y ago
    The 6 articles you linked neither mention money laundering, nor describe something that qualifies (in my understanding) as money laundering.
    - lawtalkinghuman 5y ago
      The original post did not use money laundering in the legal sense but in the ordinary language use sense of the phrase.
      - blueflow 5y ago
        Don't bullshit me, we both know it was written with defamatory intent, and it turned out its not substantiable. Its slander.
      - tarboreus 5y ago
        ...which means what? This seems like an odd equivocation. Is money laundering the newest term to get a new, politically useful definition?

bko 5y ago

I think there's an idea that if someone is thought to have a certain set of beliefs they should be refused basic services such as the ability to store/transfer/receive value and the ability to earn a living. So if something enables them to have these basic services, it's a grave threat. According to the president of the US, the ideology is the deadliest threat to the US. So keeping money out of the hands of people thought to be sympathetic to the cause is vital. > "We won't ignore what our intelligence agencies have determined to be the most lethal terrorist threat to our homeland today: White supremacy is terrorism," Biden said. "We're not going to ignore that either." https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/white-supremacy-most-lethal-threat-to-america-biden-says/ar-BB1gaa5Q https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/white-supremacy-most...

kamray23 5y ago
It's not just far-right either. Cryptocurrency, despite its appearance of full traceability and transparency, provides an incredibly easy method for money laundering in the long term and has been used to do so by every side. Many communist countries utilize cryptocurrency to perform transactions outside international trade law, bypassing blockades and sanctions normally enforced by banks, foreign offices, and physical blockade. Criminals of course love the damn thing, hackers especially. The technology is good but it has so many bad uses that it's still a real ethical gray area for a lot of people. Not to mention the countless scams profiting off people who don't know any better and literally advertised and peddled by modern mass media.
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  It's literally problems with cash, scaled up to the extent that they become a qualitatively new problem due to the sheer ease and low risk of shifting money. I wonder if it's even morally consistent to take the view they cash is fine, but cryptocurrency isn't.
- ludamad 5y ago
  Cash seems a lot better for crime, except for international use. "There should be no international cash equivalent" - would you agree with this?