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Plug computing and Linksys routers weren't cheap, and the Pi was. That's the entire difference when your target audience is kids with a couple of dollars worth

Plug computing and Linksys routers weren't cheap, and the Pi was. That's the entire difference when your target audience is kids with a couple of dollars worth of allowance or broke college kids.

bityard 5y ago
> Plug computing and Linksys routers weren't cheap, and the Pi was. For their time (20 years ago), they certainly were cheap. $100 or so for a small power efficient box that could run almost a whole Linux distribution was an amazing bargain. Before that, you needed a good-sized desktop or server to do anything involving a Unix-like OS, or paid dearly for the convenience of a laptop. And it wasn't much before that, that running Unix on any microcomputer was just a dream. It's hard to comprend just how amazingly affordable computing has become in such a short amount of time.
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  Do you realise that a $100 is a fortune to the demographic that I specified? For that price, those devices are so out of reach that they might as well just not exist. I remember that time in my life very well. I literally had around $50 in my local currency in the coin box, and that was it. Hand me down computers were unavailable where I was.
  - GhettoComputers 5y ago
    Everyone had one anyway because they needed a router. It was "free". Used ones were common too.
Nursie 5y ago
Ok, but that doesn’t mean that the Pi was important in getting most Linux or BSD tools working under ARM, as was the claim above. Yes, it reached a wide audience, they did a lot of great stuff getting capable dev boards out to a lot of people. But fully functional Linux on ARM pre-dates the Pi significantly. (I’d argue the NSLU2 and sheevaplug were both pretty affordable, at sub-$100 too, but the Pi definitely upped the game there)
- b112 5y ago
  Indeed. Debian had full ARM support for years before the Pi, very mature, and was really the only reason the Pi project could even choose ARM. If not for Debian's work, which the Pi relies upon, they'd have never been able to bootstrap.
  - selfhoster11 5y ago
    Debian project also deserves some credit - so let's credit them. There's enough credit to go around got everyone who helped to bring this about.
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  In the chicken and egg problem of getting support for ARM software, the Raspberry Pi Foundation was the one that unilaterally plopped a ready-to-go (if very weak), low cost chicken in front of everyone. For that, I think they deserve some credit. Sure they built in top of the work of others - so let's acknowledge everyone involved in the process rather than pretend that one party deserves fame exclusively. It was a community effort :)
  - Nursie 5y ago
    > getting support for ARM software It is my contention that this support was largely already present. That's all. Pi did great work getting cheap boards out to people, and put a lot of effort into education and community building. They exposed a huge number of people to the possibilities of non-x86 computing that otherwise might not have been. So indeed let's credit them with that, it's all great stuff! But it's quite revisionist to say they helped get linux or BSD or their tools onto the platform, IMHO.
- OJFord 5y ago
  The wide audience itself is a big motivator to get them working on Arm.
  - selfhoster11 5y ago

Plug computing and Linksys routers weren't cheap, and the Pi was. That's the entire difference when your target audience is kids with a couple of dollars worth of allowance or broke college kids.

bityard 5y ago

> Plug computing and Linksys routers weren't cheap, and the Pi was. For their time (20 years ago), they certainly were cheap. $100 or so for a small power efficient box that could run almost a whole Linux distribution was an amazing bargain. Before that, you needed a good-sized desktop or server to do anything involving a Unix-like OS, or paid dearly for the convenience of a laptop. And it wasn't much before that, that running Unix on any microcomputer was just a dream. It's hard to comprend just how amazingly affordable computing has become in such a short amount of time.

selfhoster11 5y ago
Do you realise that a $100 is a fortune to the demographic that I specified? For that price, those devices are so out of reach that they might as well just not exist. I remember that time in my life very well. I literally had around $50 in my local currency in the coin box, and that was it. Hand me down computers were unavailable where I was.
- GhettoComputers 5y ago
  Everyone had one anyway because they needed a router. It was "free". Used ones were common too.

Nursie 5y ago

Ok, but that doesn’t mean that the Pi was important in getting most Linux or BSD tools working under ARM, as was the claim above. Yes, it reached a wide audience, they did a lot of great stuff getting capable dev boards out to a lot of people. But fully functional Linux on ARM pre-dates the Pi significantly. (I’d argue the NSLU2 and sheevaplug were both pretty affordable, at sub-$100 too, but the Pi definitely upped the game there)

b112 5y ago
Indeed. Debian had full ARM support for years before the Pi, very mature, and was really the only reason the Pi project could even choose ARM. If not for Debian's work, which the Pi relies upon, they'd have never been able to bootstrap.
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  Debian project also deserves some credit - so let's credit them. There's enough credit to go around got everyone who helped to bring this about.
selfhoster11 5y ago
In the chicken and egg problem of getting support for ARM software, the Raspberry Pi Foundation was the one that unilaterally plopped a ready-to-go (if very weak), low cost chicken in front of everyone. For that, I think they deserve some credit. Sure they built in top of the work of others - so let's acknowledge everyone involved in the process rather than pretend that one party deserves fame exclusively. It was a community effort :)
- Nursie 5y ago
  > getting support for ARM software It is my contention that this support was largely already present. That's all. Pi did great work getting cheap boards out to people, and put a lot of effort into education and community building. They exposed a huge number of people to the possibilities of non-x86 computing that otherwise might not have been. So indeed let's credit them with that, it's all great stuff! But it's quite revisionist to say they helped get linux or BSD or their tools onto the platform, IMHO.
OJFord 5y ago
The wide audience itself is a big motivator to get them working on Arm.
- selfhoster11 5y ago