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This is a fascinating site beyond the power indicator. For example, a recent article discusses low-tech solar panels: > ... To start with, ever since the 1950s

This is a fascinating site beyond the power indicator. For example, a recent article discusses low-tech solar panels: > ... To start with, ever since the 1950s, solar panels have been unfit for recycling, resulting in a waste stream that ends up in landfills. This waste stream will grow significantly during the coming years. Solar panels are discarded only after at least 25 to 30 years, and most have been installed only in recent years. By 2050, researchers expect that almost 80 million tonnes of solar panels will reach the end of their lives. 1 2 3 That is a significant waste of resources and a danger to the environment – discarded solar PV panels contain toxic elements and present a fire hazard. https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2021/10/how-to-build-a-low-tech-solar-panel.html https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2021/10/how-to-build-a-low...

stephen_g 5y ago
We have some solar panel recycling companies coming online here in Australia already ([1] for example, but there are at least three or four other companies I've heard of starting up), and I'm sure that will be the case elsewhere as well, so I don't know how accurate that is. It's worth putting it in perspective too - huge amounts of waste are generated in power generation that solar is replacing, like coal power. One source (quoting research from IEA but the original document link is dead now) puts the amount of coal ash produced each year at 3.7 billion tons [2]. Here in Australia, it makes up more than one fifth of all waste produced in the country, and most of it is just dumped (in some places around the world it's used as an additive in concrete). But coal fly ash is full of highly toxic elements, including heavy metals. 1. https://reneweconomy.com.au/australias-first-solar-panel-recycling-plant-swings-into-action/ https://reneweconomy.com.au/australias-first-solar-panel-rec... 2. https://www.envirojustice.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/EJA_CoalAshReport-lr.pdf https://www.envirojustice.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/...
onethought 5y ago
How is PV unfit for recycling? It’s pure silicon, with something like Boron on it. Losslessly recycling might be challenge, but you could definitely reuse all the Silicon and remake another panel. Which toxic elements do you mean? What’s the fire hazard?
- justsaying9 5y ago
  It is believed they over time slowly absorb rays of smugness from virtue signalling urbanites in the surrounding vicinity, gradually rendering the panel material radioactive and unfit for future use, even after recycling. Some believe this effect can be mitigated by first sprinkling the unit with the used oil from a sacrificed Chevy 350 engine, while walking in a counterclockwise circle and chanting a priestly incantation. More scientific study is needed to confirm or deny the efficacy of this approach.
- culi 5y ago
  While solar cells might be almost pure silicon, the panels themselves use a lot more materials to work. For example, 2% of all global copper production was just for panels 2018. The frames and the cells both use aluminum (the actual most abundant material overall). Silver, the most expensive component, has been pushed from about 400mg per panel in 2007 to about 100mg per panel today.[0] Each solar panel contains about 14mg of lead which means around 4.4k tons were used in the production of solar panels in 2018.[1] This is much smaller than, say batteries (which solar panels drive a huge demand for), but is still significant considering lead has been found to leak into the environment from solar panels even from regular rainfall.[2] In 2017, a study found that as much as 62% of the cadmium from cadmium telluride models were leached out at room temperature depending mostly on acidity of the solutions.[3] "Even only one day of leaching of two module pieces in 1 day of acid rain and neutral solution is sufficient to exceed the World Health Organization (WHO) drinking water limit: for Cd the threshold limit is 3 µg=L.33) Even under alkaline conditions (pH 11), it takes only three days to exceed this limit. After nearly one year, the Cd concentration cCd in acidic solutions is almost 20000 µg=L (62%)" [4] [0] https://www.freeingenergy.com/do-we-have-enough-materials-to-make-the-solar-panels-needed-for-a-clean-energy-future/ https://www.freeingenergy.com/do-we-have-enough-materials-to... [1] https://www.freeingenergy.com/are-solar-panels-really-full-of-toxic-materials-like-cadmium-and-lead/ https://www.freeingenergy.com/are-solar-panels-really-full-o... [2] https://www.zmescience.com/science/solar-panels-lead-plants-21012020/ https://www.zmescience.com/science/solar-panels-lead-plants-... [3] https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.7567/JJAP.56.08MD02/meta https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.7567/JJAP.56.08MD02/me... [4] https://sci-hub.se/https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.7567/JJAP.56.08MD02/meta https://sci-hub.se/https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.756...
culi 5y ago
To put that in perspective, in 2019 we generated a total of 53.6 million metric tons of e-waste.[0] By 2050, we expect to be generating 6 million new metric tons of e-waste from solar panels alone.[1] [0] https://ewastemonitor.info/gem-2020/ https://ewastemonitor.info/gem-2020/ [1] https://grist.org/energy/solar-panels-are-starting-to-die-what-will-we-do-with-the-megatons-of-toxic-trash/ https://grist.org/energy/solar-panels-are-starting-to-die-wh...
kmstout 5y ago
There's another article that discusses a material-efficient way of making domes arches and vaulted ceilings: https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2008/11/tiles-vaults.html https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2008/11/tiles-vaults.html I've been watching videos of the technique. It's almost as relaxing as watching a professional butcher dismantle a cow.

stephen_g 5y ago

We have some solar panel recycling companies coming online here in Australia already ([1] for example, but there are at least three or four other companies I've heard of starting up), and I'm sure that will be the case elsewhere as well, so I don't know how accurate that is. It's worth putting it in perspective too - huge amounts of waste are generated in power generation that solar is replacing, like coal power. One source (quoting research from IEA but the original document link is dead now) puts the amount of coal ash produced each year at 3.7 billion tons [2]. Here in Australia, it makes up more than one fifth of all waste produced in the country, and most of it is just dumped (in some places around the world it's used as an additive in concrete). But coal fly ash is full of highly toxic elements, including heavy metals. 1. https://reneweconomy.com.au/australias-first-solar-panel-recycling-plant-swings-into-action/ https://reneweconomy.com.au/australias-first-solar-panel-rec... 2. https://www.envirojustice.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/EJA_CoalAshReport-lr.pdf https://www.envirojustice.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/...

onethought 5y ago

How is PV unfit for recycling? It’s pure silicon, with something like Boron on it. Losslessly recycling might be challenge, but you could definitely reuse all the Silicon and remake another panel. Which toxic elements do you mean? What’s the fire hazard?

justsaying9 5y ago
It is believed they over time slowly absorb rays of smugness from virtue signalling urbanites in the surrounding vicinity, gradually rendering the panel material radioactive and unfit for future use, even after recycling. Some believe this effect can be mitigated by first sprinkling the unit with the used oil from a sacrificed Chevy 350 engine, while walking in a counterclockwise circle and chanting a priestly incantation. More scientific study is needed to confirm or deny the efficacy of this approach.
culi 5y ago
While solar cells might be almost pure silicon, the panels themselves use a lot more materials to work. For example, 2% of all global copper production was just for panels 2018. The frames and the cells both use aluminum (the actual most abundant material overall). Silver, the most expensive component, has been pushed from about 400mg per panel in 2007 to about 100mg per panel today.[0] Each solar panel contains about 14mg of lead which means around 4.4k tons were used in the production of solar panels in 2018.[1] This is much smaller than, say batteries (which solar panels drive a huge demand for), but is still significant considering lead has been found to leak into the environment from solar panels even from regular rainfall.[2] In 2017, a study found that as much as 62% of the cadmium from cadmium telluride models were leached out at room temperature depending mostly on acidity of the solutions.[3] "Even only one day of leaching of two module pieces in 1 day of acid rain and neutral solution is sufficient to exceed the World Health Organization (WHO) drinking water limit: for Cd the threshold limit is 3 µg=L.33) Even under alkaline conditions (pH 11), it takes only three days to exceed this limit. After nearly one year, the Cd concentration cCd in acidic solutions is almost 20000 µg=L (62%)" [4] [0] https://www.freeingenergy.com/do-we-have-enough-materials-to-make-the-solar-panels-needed-for-a-clean-energy-future/ https://www.freeingenergy.com/do-we-have-enough-materials-to... [1] https://www.freeingenergy.com/are-solar-panels-really-full-of-toxic-materials-like-cadmium-and-lead/ https://www.freeingenergy.com/are-solar-panels-really-full-o... [2] https://www.zmescience.com/science/solar-panels-lead-plants-21012020/ https://www.zmescience.com/science/solar-panels-lead-plants-... [3] https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.7567/JJAP.56.08MD02/meta https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.7567/JJAP.56.08MD02/me... [4] https://sci-hub.se/https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.7567/JJAP.56.08MD02/meta https://sci-hub.se/https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.756...

culi 5y ago

To put that in perspective, in 2019 we generated a total of 53.6 million metric tons of e-waste.[0] By 2050, we expect to be generating 6 million new metric tons of e-waste from solar panels alone.[1] [0] https://ewastemonitor.info/gem-2020/ https://ewastemonitor.info/gem-2020/ [1] https://grist.org/energy/solar-panels-are-starting-to-die-what-will-we-do-with-the-megatons-of-toxic-trash/ https://grist.org/energy/solar-panels-are-starting-to-die-wh...

kmstout 5y ago

There's another article that discusses a material-efficient way of making domes arches and vaulted ceilings: https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2008/11/tiles-vaults.html https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2008/11/tiles-vaults.html I've been watching videos of the technique. It's almost as relaxing as watching a professional butcher dismantle a cow.