5 ms·

This reminds of a passage from Dune (context: the planet the book is set on is a desert with a very limited amount of water): > "There were water riots when it

This reminds of a passage from Dune (context: the planet the book is set on is a desert with a very limited amount of water): > "There were water riots when it was learned how many people the Duke was adding to the population," she said. "They stopped only when the people learned we were installing new windtraps and condensers to take care of the load." > "There is only so much water to support human life here," he said. "The people know if more come to drink a limited amount of water, the price goes up and the very poor die. But the Duke has solved this. It doesn’t follow that the riots mean permanent hostility toward him."

watwut 5y ago
Dune is made up. While arguing with history makes some sense, arguing what might happen make some sense, arguing by "fiction had this story in it" does not make sense.
- mensetmanusman 5y ago
  Fiction is a tool for elaborate analogies. People learn well through analogy, and it can be a lot more persuasive than an economics textbook, because people might actually read it.
  - watwut 5y ago
    The above quote was not elaborate.
    - mensetmanusman 5y ago
      I was referring to the world of Dune :)
- j7ake 5y ago
  Dune is “made up” just as much as economists making predictions about future world populations are made up. They are both toy models that can be useful to inform real life.
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > They are both toy models Dune is not a model, toy or otherwise, it is a narrative with no independent variables. The illusion that there is a model involved is art, just as the illusion of (say) spaceships in the film version.
  - watwut 5y ago
    They are not comparable at all. And economic models are taken with massive e caution too. There is difference between fiction and reality. Dune is fiction.
- neilparikh 5y ago
  I'm not really sure what your criticism is, to be honest. I'll just microanalyze my comment and hope it ends up responding to your point. The passage I posted is basically just, "X is limited, adding more people will lead to X shortages, let's find a way to use X more efficiently", with X replied with water. The implication of me saying this is that you can also replace X with land. Obviously, I could have just said "let's just build more housing, then immigration won't lead to housing shortages", but I think that's a less interesting comment. By instead using the passage, I've done 2 things: pointed out that other people have thought about this issue (in another domain), and encouraged a few people to look up Dune, and maybe read it. Would your criticism apply if my comment instead said "let's just build more housing, then immigration won't lead to housing shortages"? Because I think that form has equivalent content (in terms of the underlying message), so if it doesn't apply that form, I don't think it applies to the current form either.

watwut 5y ago

Dune is made up. While arguing with history makes some sense, arguing what might happen make some sense, arguing by "fiction had this story in it" does not make sense.

mensetmanusman 5y ago
Fiction is a tool for elaborate analogies. People learn well through analogy, and it can be a lot more persuasive than an economics textbook, because people might actually read it.
- watwut 5y ago
  The above quote was not elaborate.
  - mensetmanusman 5y ago
    I was referring to the world of Dune :)
j7ake 5y ago
Dune is “made up” just as much as economists making predictions about future world populations are made up. They are both toy models that can be useful to inform real life.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > They are both toy models Dune is not a model, toy or otherwise, it is a narrative with no independent variables. The illusion that there is a model involved is art, just as the illusion of (say) spaceships in the film version.
- watwut 5y ago
  They are not comparable at all. And economic models are taken with massive e caution too. There is difference between fiction and reality. Dune is fiction.
neilparikh 5y ago
I'm not really sure what your criticism is, to be honest. I'll just microanalyze my comment and hope it ends up responding to your point. The passage I posted is basically just, "X is limited, adding more people will lead to X shortages, let's find a way to use X more efficiently", with X replied with water. The implication of me saying this is that you can also replace X with land. Obviously, I could have just said "let's just build more housing, then immigration won't lead to housing shortages", but I think that's a less interesting comment. By instead using the passage, I've done 2 things: pointed out that other people have thought about this issue (in another domain), and encouraged a few people to look up Dune, and maybe read it. Would your criticism apply if my comment instead said "let's just build more housing, then immigration won't lead to housing shortages"? Because I think that form has equivalent content (in terms of the underlying message), so if it doesn't apply that form, I don't think it applies to the current form either.