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The Great British Reading List

57 points by axiomdata316 5y ago

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
bob667 5y ago
Lol a list for the people who hate Britain then. These clowns are surprised when we elect the tories
mikej1000 5y ago
What a miserable list. The ordinary Brits I know - friends and coworkers - are kind, hardworking and tolerant. That includes the people I know who voted for Brexit. And the British seaside is great - go to Scarborough for a day in the summer and watch families (plenty of Asian families now) playing cricket on the beach. Britain's doing ok.
- watwut 5y ago
  So, you like long walks or not? And the who killed the cat book is bad insurance opinion?
shaftoe444 5y ago
I'm English and I think this list is terrible. It won't help you understand this country except for the narrow section of opinion that went mad after the Brexit vote. I won't make an alternative list but reading The Pickwick Papers will give more profit than this whole list.
- Veen 5y ago
  Yes, this list is really focused on "why Britain has always been crap and is even crapper after Brexit". A genre that has become ubiquitous in recent years. It's almost entirely composed of books and articles written by anti-Brexit Guardian and Indie writers.
  - LightG 5y ago
    "... crapper after Brexit". Well, looking around ... that element of the statement is 100% correct. Looking to emigrate from this sinking ship.
    - Veen 5y ago
      Things are certainly a bit crap at the moment—there is a global pandemic on, after all. But I find the constant "post Brexit, ergo propter Brexit" stuff tiresome and tendentious. I voted Remain, but Brexit is done and now we have to get on with things. I'm not sure it's any better in the U.S. or France—there's a good chance France is about to vote for a president that makes Boris look reasonable by comparison, for example. Scandinavia might be nice if you're looking to turn your back on your country, but there's no guarantee they'll take you.
      - LightG 5y ago
        I take your point, but the "you do realise there is a global pandemic on" take I hear often is also tiresome. I'm experiencing first-hand, in our business, the hassles and challenges that have come with Brexit (during a global pandemic) and I genuinely just throw my hands up and say "WTF were we thinking". I'm considering New Zealand. Slightly cliche in tech circles now, I know, but I spent a year there 10 years ago and looking to go back now. Note, this is my down-slope plan. I don't need to be in the traditional centres of business. I'm not trying to disrupt tech or earn a billy! And, with respect, I don't consider this my country. Plenty of lovely people here, and I feel for them, but the place has gone off the deep end.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
bencollier49 5y ago
So instead of reading this nasty list of anti-British propaganda pieces, there's an actually decent list of British books, which was put online by "Culture Trip", whoever they are: https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/england/articles/12-books-to-read-before-visiting-england/ https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/england/art... This covers a wide range of history, and does cover (pre)modern culture - Zadie Smith's "White Teeth", for example.
- shaftoe444 5y ago
  That is a good list. I'll submit one opinion about the English, that we don't do theory and express ourselves and ideas best in fiction.
- stuaxo 5y ago
  There is one on the list that is "the long con of Britishness", not sure how the rest can be seen as "anti British".
  - bencollier49 5y ago
    "Why I'm utterly sick of going for a walk" strikes at British culture in a very particularly Guardianish way. Then we have a class diatribe and a Brexit moan. I'll give you the marmalade.
    - stuaxo 5y ago
      The walk thing I just found amusing, my parents loved walking but I hated it as a kid, came to appreciate it more. Then in the lockdown with a small child, with one nice walk nearby, walking it again and again it goes so boring - it resonated as something funny, it seems like people are looking for things to be offended by? It's also funny as Guardian readers are right in the "going for a walk" demographic - it's poking fun at themselves.
    - somewhereoutth 5y ago
      Given that Brexit is by any objective measure an act purely of destruction, born of fear and selfishness, I think a moan might be justified.
sgt101 5y ago
My take is that a ruling class developed in the UK from the time of Blair's election through to the 2016 referendum. These were folks in my demographic, born in the 1970's, state educated (up to and including postgraduate Oxbridge) and exposed to the first waves of always on media. They watched Gulf War 1 on CNN and they probably went on marches against Gulf War 2, but forgot about it more or less immediately after all the bombs had dropped. In general the live in large cities, many in London or Bristol or Oxford or Manchester or Leeds or Edinburgh. Fewer in Liverpool or Cardiff or Belfast or Glasgow though. This class bought into the vision of a united europe because it brought direct benefits for them. They could get cheap goods & services and they could earn loads in the City. They also like the idea and practice of a united europe because it insulated them from the reality of the UK in terms of the actuality of the infrastructure, civil institutions and democratic structures. This allowed folks to disengage from the process of smashing up local government and the civil service, instead the action was in Westminster and Brussels - and with the commission. The processes above meant that the wheal of the UK population has to live with disfunctional services. Local transportation is greatly reduced from historic levels (no buses), the health service is strained to look after a dumbell demographic (old brits who consume healtcare but don't pay, young migrants who consume healthcare but don't pay), no social housing, reduced social care, bad jobs and terrible schools. On the other hand the elite (me) have private healthcare (virtually unheard of when I was a kid) million pound houses, teslas etc etc. The referendum was a response to the disaster of 2011->14 in Greece culminating with the UK's veto being ignored - I don't think that the UK gov expected to end up running a referendum but it was like political gravity once that happened and they were dragged into it. This opened up the truth of the national divide that has opened up and the schism between the haves and the don't haves. All of this is remarkably similar to the Trumpian schism in the USA, but the difference is that Johnson is not Trump. His key sin (of the week) is that he hosted a Christmas quiz on Zoom last year, apparently having had too much booze. And Johnson will be gone soon and adult supervision of the Tory party will resume, probably in opposition. I don't see any other post referendum figure looming behind Johnson to take the mantle of populism and if Johnson was ever going to do that then surely his moment has passed. In any case whenever he's been pushed to make a policy choice it's generally been quite unpopular and fundamentally progressive - for example sticking 1% on tax to pay for more health care. So - if the UK political establishment can get it's act together there is a chance to move forward, we are not faced with the horror of Trump 2024. If it doesn't then the UK will drift downwards like a leaf on the wind and eventually there will be another crisis. This will come because there is a rarely discussed dynamic of the UK's integration with the EU which is that the UK ran a gigantic trade deficit with the EU (Germany in particular) due to the Euro's devaluation vs. the DM. Johnson has not fixed this and in fact has made it worse because of not putting tariffs on EU imports. He can't because of the pandemic and the failure of the UK (and global) logistic infrastructure, but one of the things that's coming is the moment that the UK government decides that it either will do this, or has to do this. The has to may come with a balance of payments crisis and a Turkish Lira style run on Sterling, so I see how the balance of trade is sorted as the litmus test for the future of the UK. If the government gets it right I see the UK developing as a Singapore on Thames, if it gets it wrong then I think not so much. Anyway, I will be nearly dead by then along with the rest of the Blairite scum who have got us to here and are now so angry on Twitter about what they think they didn't do.
dcminter 5y ago
I've no opinion on these books as I've not read 'em. Some hackles raised by them it seems? I dare say it's a political bias one way or the other. I can't offer much on the "British" as we're diverse countries with not so much in common. But for the one I feel qualified to speak on, England, try Kate Fox's excellent "Watching the English." It's a bit cosy, so don't read it if you want to see us eviscerated, but it's well observed for all that.
stuaxo 5y ago
Amusing to see the marmalade article on here, contrary to it - most people do not have marmalade for breakfast in the UK.
yelskcol 5y ago
For a list supposedly compiled by someone introducing themselves as a Brit returning from abroad it's funny how it reads as a mixture of cross Atlantic cliche (ah yes, those funny, quirky Brits and their marmalade) to the usual tired stuff about how the national character has supposedly changed over night with the advent of Brexit. The UK isn't without its challenges and issues at the moment but there are many far worse places you could find to live.
globalise83 5y ago
- Porterhouse Blue - House of Cards - Any of Spike Milligan's memoirs - The Diary of Samuel Pepys - A Dance to the Music of Time - Any of the Flashman novels - Any of the novels on this list: https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20151204-the-100-greatest-british-novels https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20151204-the-100-greates...
cafard 5y ago
"Whatever the reason, Great Britain is an obscure place". Obscure to whom? I hope Longreads will let us know about other obscure places: New York, Los Angeles, Paris, Rome...
joeman1000 5y ago
This just seems so boring and negative. Read Sherlock Holmes if you want something awesome and British. Forget this rubbish.

57 points by axiomdata316 5y ago

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

bob667 5y ago

Lol a list for the people who hate Britain then. These clowns are surprised when we elect the tories

mikej1000 5y ago

What a miserable list. The ordinary Brits I know - friends and coworkers - are kind, hardworking and tolerant. That includes the people I know who voted for Brexit. And the British seaside is great - go to Scarborough for a day in the summer and watch families (plenty of Asian families now) playing cricket on the beach. Britain's doing ok.

watwut 5y ago
So, you like long walks or not? And the who killed the cat book is bad insurance opinion?

shaftoe444 5y ago

I'm English and I think this list is terrible. It won't help you understand this country except for the narrow section of opinion that went mad after the Brexit vote. I won't make an alternative list but reading The Pickwick Papers will give more profit than this whole list.

Veen 5y ago
Yes, this list is really focused on "why Britain has always been crap and is even crapper after Brexit". A genre that has become ubiquitous in recent years. It's almost entirely composed of books and articles written by anti-Brexit Guardian and Indie writers.
- LightG 5y ago
  "... crapper after Brexit". Well, looking around ... that element of the statement is 100% correct. Looking to emigrate from this sinking ship.
  - Veen 5y ago
    Things are certainly a bit crap at the moment—there is a global pandemic on, after all. But I find the constant "post Brexit, ergo propter Brexit" stuff tiresome and tendentious. I voted Remain, but Brexit is done and now we have to get on with things. I'm not sure it's any better in the U.S. or France—there's a good chance France is about to vote for a president that makes Boris look reasonable by comparison, for example. Scandinavia might be nice if you're looking to turn your back on your country, but there's no guarantee they'll take you.
    - LightG 5y ago
      I take your point, but the "you do realise there is a global pandemic on" take I hear often is also tiresome. I'm experiencing first-hand, in our business, the hassles and challenges that have come with Brexit (during a global pandemic) and I genuinely just throw my hands up and say "WTF were we thinking". I'm considering New Zealand. Slightly cliche in tech circles now, I know, but I spent a year there 10 years ago and looking to go back now. Note, this is my down-slope plan. I don't need to be in the traditional centres of business. I'm not trying to disrupt tech or earn a billy! And, with respect, I don't consider this my country. Plenty of lovely people here, and I feel for them, but the place has gone off the deep end.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

bencollier49 5y ago

So instead of reading this nasty list of anti-British propaganda pieces, there's an actually decent list of British books, which was put online by "Culture Trip", whoever they are: https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/england/articles/12-books-to-read-before-visiting-england/ https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united-kingdom/england/art... This covers a wide range of history, and does cover (pre)modern culture - Zadie Smith's "White Teeth", for example.

shaftoe444 5y ago
That is a good list. I'll submit one opinion about the English, that we don't do theory and express ourselves and ideas best in fiction.
stuaxo 5y ago
There is one on the list that is "the long con of Britishness", not sure how the rest can be seen as "anti British".
- bencollier49 5y ago
  "Why I'm utterly sick of going for a walk" strikes at British culture in a very particularly Guardianish way. Then we have a class diatribe and a Brexit moan. I'll give you the marmalade.
  - stuaxo 5y ago
    The walk thing I just found amusing, my parents loved walking but I hated it as a kid, came to appreciate it more. Then in the lockdown with a small child, with one nice walk nearby, walking it again and again it goes so boring - it resonated as something funny, it seems like people are looking for things to be offended by? It's also funny as Guardian readers are right in the "going for a walk" demographic - it's poking fun at themselves.
  - somewhereoutth 5y ago
    Given that Brexit is by any objective measure an act purely of destruction, born of fear and selfishness, I think a moan might be justified.

sgt101 5y ago

My take is that a ruling class developed in the UK from the time of Blair's election through to the 2016 referendum. These were folks in my demographic, born in the 1970's, state educated (up to and including postgraduate Oxbridge) and exposed to the first waves of always on media. They watched Gulf War 1 on CNN and they probably went on marches against Gulf War 2, but forgot about it more or less immediately after all the bombs had dropped. In general the live in large cities, many in London or Bristol or Oxford or Manchester or Leeds or Edinburgh. Fewer in Liverpool or Cardiff or Belfast or Glasgow though. This class bought into the vision of a united europe because it brought direct benefits for them. They could get cheap goods & services and they could earn loads in the City. They also like the idea and practice of a united europe because it insulated them from the reality of the UK in terms of the actuality of the infrastructure, civil institutions and democratic structures. This allowed folks to disengage from the process of smashing up local government and the civil service, instead the action was in Westminster and Brussels - and with the commission. The processes above meant that the wheal of the UK population has to live with disfunctional services. Local transportation is greatly reduced from historic levels (no buses), the health service is strained to look after a dumbell demographic (old brits who consume healtcare but don't pay, young migrants who consume healthcare but don't pay), no social housing, reduced social care, bad jobs and terrible schools. On the other hand the elite (me) have private healthcare (virtually unheard of when I was a kid) million pound houses, teslas etc etc. The referendum was a response to the disaster of 2011->14 in Greece culminating with the UK's veto being ignored - I don't think that the UK gov expected to end up running a referendum but it was like political gravity once that happened and they were dragged into it. This opened up the truth of the national divide that has opened up and the schism between the haves and the don't haves. All of this is remarkably similar to the Trumpian schism in the USA, but the difference is that Johnson is not Trump. His key sin (of the week) is that he hosted a Christmas quiz on Zoom last year, apparently having had too much booze. And Johnson will be gone soon and adult supervision of the Tory party will resume, probably in opposition. I don't see any other post referendum figure looming behind Johnson to take the mantle of populism and if Johnson was ever going to do that then surely his moment has passed. In any case whenever he's been pushed to make a policy choice it's generally been quite unpopular and fundamentally progressive - for example sticking 1% on tax to pay for more health care. So - if the UK political establishment can get it's act together there is a chance to move forward, we are not faced with the horror of Trump 2024. If it doesn't then the UK will drift downwards like a leaf on the wind and eventually there will be another crisis. This will come because there is a rarely discussed dynamic of the UK's integration with the EU which is that the UK ran a gigantic trade deficit with the EU (Germany in particular) due to the Euro's devaluation vs. the DM. Johnson has not fixed this and in fact has made it worse because of not putting tariffs on EU imports. He can't because of the pandemic and the failure of the UK (and global) logistic infrastructure, but one of the things that's coming is the moment that the UK government decides that it either will do this, or has to do this. The has to may come with a balance of payments crisis and a Turkish Lira style run on Sterling, so I see how the balance of trade is sorted as the litmus test for the future of the UK. If the government gets it right I see the UK developing as a Singapore on Thames, if it gets it wrong then I think not so much. Anyway, I will be nearly dead by then along with the rest of the Blairite scum who have got us to here and are now so angry on Twitter about what they think they didn't do.

dcminter 5y ago

I've no opinion on these books as I've not read 'em. Some hackles raised by them it seems? I dare say it's a political bias one way or the other. I can't offer much on the "British" as we're diverse countries with not so much in common. But for the one I feel qualified to speak on, England, try Kate Fox's excellent "Watching the English." It's a bit cosy, so don't read it if you want to see us eviscerated, but it's well observed for all that.

stuaxo 5y ago

Amusing to see the marmalade article on here, contrary to it - most people do not have marmalade for breakfast in the UK.

yelskcol 5y ago

For a list supposedly compiled by someone introducing themselves as a Brit returning from abroad it's funny how it reads as a mixture of cross Atlantic cliche (ah yes, those funny, quirky Brits and their marmalade) to the usual tired stuff about how the national character has supposedly changed over night with the advent of Brexit. The UK isn't without its challenges and issues at the moment but there are many far worse places you could find to live.

globalise83 5y ago

- Porterhouse Blue - House of Cards - Any of Spike Milligan's memoirs - The Diary of Samuel Pepys - A Dance to the Music of Time - Any of the Flashman novels - Any of the novels on this list: https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20151204-the-100-greatest-british-novels https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20151204-the-100-greates...

cafard 5y ago

"Whatever the reason, Great Britain is an obscure place". Obscure to whom? I hope Longreads will let us know about other obscure places: New York, Los Angeles, Paris, Rome...

joeman1000 5y ago

This just seems so boring and negative. Read Sherlock Holmes if you want something awesome and British. Forget this rubbish.