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A classic repost; but a topic that never goes out of style and needs repeating. I have a family member that is a detective with a state police group… the amoun

A classic repost; but a topic that never goes out of style and needs repeating. I have a family member that is a detective with a state police group… the amount of things people willing give up to police is astounding. Cuts both ways, one I can think of he wished he the suspect hadn’t said something (a victimless crime done for a good reason) and now hints to people in similar situations about a lawyer before they open their mouth.

mcny 5y ago
> Cuts both ways IIRC The Fraternal Order of Police always reminds its members to not talk to the police. When administration asks questions, members should ask whether answering the question is required as a part of their job. If the answer is no, the member (police officer) should decline to answer any question. Even the police won't talk to the police. There is no reason why anyone should. Nobody should ever "help" law enforcement investigate any crime. Never volunteer any information. Additionally, I think lying to law enforcement should not be a crime. I am not bitter that an ex Lieutenant General got a pardon. I am very bitter that I could never get a pardon. How would I stand any chance when even one time billionaire Martha Stewart was convicted of lying to federal officers? Rules for thee but not for me. I just want a level playing field. >> Flynn's attorneys submitted a sentencing memo on December 11, 2018, requesting leniency and suggesting FBI agents had tricked him into lying during the January 24, 2017 White House interview and did not advise him that lying to federal agents is a felony. The memo also asserted that Flynn's relaxed behavior during the interview indicated he was being truthful. Trump echoed this assertion two days later on Twitter and Fox News, asserting, "They convinced him he did lie, and he made some kind of a deal. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Flynn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Flynn Lying should not be a crime in itself. The only way you can prove someone lied is if you know the truth anyway. Why does it matter if I lied if you knew the truth already? Similarly, why is "treason" a crime if we refuse to try a former POTUS? Once again, rules for thee but not for me.
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poulsbohemian 5y ago
>he wished he the suspect hadn’t said something (a victimless crime done for a good reason) This also cuts to the issue that many have with policing in the US: Is the purpose "law enforcement" or "public safety"? This is a deep philosophical difference at the heart of many issues in contemporary American politics. It's equally interesting to ask what are the motivations and incentives in these two perspectives. Personally, I'd argue that if it were in fact a "victimless crime" then the situation has been made far worse by enforcement. There now is a victim - the "criminal," who now has no incentive to correct their behavior or cooperate in the future. It's an opportunity for education, not penalization. And, if the police truly are in a position of enforcing a law they find unpalatable, IE: that actually harms the public good, I'd love more than anything to see them made a partner in pushing back against it, rather than the cutting edge of public discontent.

mcny 5y ago

> Cuts both ways IIRC The Fraternal Order of Police always reminds its members to not talk to the police. When administration asks questions, members should ask whether answering the question is required as a part of their job. If the answer is no, the member (police officer) should decline to answer any question. Even the police won't talk to the police. There is no reason why anyone should. Nobody should ever "help" law enforcement investigate any crime. Never volunteer any information. Additionally, I think lying to law enforcement should not be a crime. I am not bitter that an ex Lieutenant General got a pardon. I am very bitter that I could never get a pardon. How would I stand any chance when even one time billionaire Martha Stewart was convicted of lying to federal officers? Rules for thee but not for me. I just want a level playing field. >> Flynn's attorneys submitted a sentencing memo on December 11, 2018, requesting leniency and suggesting FBI agents had tricked him into lying during the January 24, 2017 White House interview and did not advise him that lying to federal agents is a felony. The memo also asserted that Flynn's relaxed behavior during the interview indicated he was being truthful. Trump echoed this assertion two days later on Twitter and Fox News, asserting, "They convinced him he did lie, and he made some kind of a deal. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Flynn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Flynn Lying should not be a crime in itself. The only way you can prove someone lied is if you know the truth anyway. Why does it matter if I lied if you knew the truth already? Similarly, why is "treason" a crime if we refuse to try a former POTUS? Once again, rules for thee but not for me.

deleted 5y ago
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poulsbohemian 5y ago

>he wished he the suspect hadn’t said something (a victimless crime done for a good reason) This also cuts to the issue that many have with policing in the US: Is the purpose "law enforcement" or "public safety"? This is a deep philosophical difference at the heart of many issues in contemporary American politics. It's equally interesting to ask what are the motivations and incentives in these two perspectives. Personally, I'd argue that if it were in fact a "victimless crime" then the situation has been made far worse by enforcement. There now is a victim - the "criminal," who now has no incentive to correct their behavior or cooperate in the future. It's an opportunity for education, not penalization. And, if the police truly are in a position of enforcing a law they find unpalatable, IE: that actually harms the public good, I'd love more than anything to see them made a partner in pushing back against it, rather than the cutting edge of public discontent.