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> call them at terrible hours ( at home) This is a really nasty idea. You’ll be bothering their family who have nothing to do with it. Sounds like you’re advoc

> call them at terrible hours ( at home) This is a really nasty idea. You’ll be bothering their family who have nothing to do with it. Sounds like you’re advocating harassment of people’s families.

foxhop 5y ago
Everyone is a family, except ENTITIES who are not humans. Wrote a poem and song to explain: --- WRONG is Tyranny. TYRANNY is WRONG, inherently so, DISASTER is WHEN, all SPARKs vibrate LOW! --- Tempest, Monster, part of the ONE. cancer's role as DOVE, painful extraordinary, deserves LOVE, not respect or authority. --- Vortex Universe Sometimes we VIBRATE down, to ASCEND up again.
mindslight 5y ago
They're already harassing you under the guise of a legal process. A clock punching attorney won't be emotionally invested in the details of a matter, but the victims of such nastygrams are - the main goal of such letters is to make you stressed and worried so you just cave - hence the corollary of hiring a professional who will handle it impersonally Two wrongs don't make a right, and it certainly may be imprudent to escalate. But there's no moral ground for them to stand on here - they're in the same category as any other spammer. Furthermore nowhere did OP advocate deliberately expanding the scope to their family. If phone calls at inconvenient-to-them times end up bothering their family as well, it's because they didn't do the work to separate their family from their ugly business. In general I don't buy into the idea of declaring some times as off limits for phone calls, since society has never given me the same courtesy in the early morning. I'd much rather get calls at 10PM than 10AM, and yet it's somehow acceptable for businesses to return an afternoon call at 9AM sharp and pretend they're doing their best to communicate.
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  A lot of words to justify that you know you’ll likely be impacting someone who did nothing against you.
  - mindslight 5y ago
    I'm sure many more words have been written by legal nastygrammers justifying their own actions of unsolicited aggression.
    - chrisseaton 5y ago
      Shouldn't we aim to have better moral standards than them when dealing with third parties? I'm just absolutely dumfounded that someone is seriously suggesting harassing a wife and children over a business relationship and repeatedly trying to justify it.
      - mindslight 5y ago
        In general? Sure. When dealing with hostile unwanted contact? Not particularly. Nobody here has advocated harassing someone's wife or children. That's a straw man you created.
        chrisseaton 5y ago
        > If phone calls at inconvenient-to-them times end up bothering their family as well, it's because they didn't do the work to separate their family from their ugly business. Real ‘nice family you have there, shame if someone would scare them with a few calls at 2am’ vibe there, and you know it.
        mindslight 5y ago
        It's more like don't harass people and then expect having a family will shield you from the repercussions. These nastygram shakedowns deliberately cause personal stress to their victims (there is little other reason to send baseless legal demands), and so escalating the situation to be personally stressful for the attackers seems like an appropriate response. As far as I can tell you're arguing that it's one thing to harass people during "business hours", but there is some greater principle whereby harassing them back at off hours is wrong because it might bother their personal associates. If you don't want to get phone calls at inconvenient times either don't be a shithead in the first place (so that people calling you respect your schedule), or figure out how to silence your phones.

foxhop 5y ago

Everyone is a family, except ENTITIES who are not humans. Wrote a poem and song to explain: --- WRONG is Tyranny. TYRANNY is WRONG, inherently so, DISASTER is WHEN, all SPARKs vibrate LOW! --- Tempest, Monster, part of the ONE. cancer's role as DOVE, painful extraordinary, deserves LOVE, not respect or authority. --- Vortex Universe Sometimes we VIBRATE down, to ASCEND up again.

mindslight 5y ago

They're already harassing you under the guise of a legal process. A clock punching attorney won't be emotionally invested in the details of a matter, but the victims of such nastygrams are - the main goal of such letters is to make you stressed and worried so you just cave - hence the corollary of hiring a professional who will handle it impersonally Two wrongs don't make a right, and it certainly may be imprudent to escalate. But there's no moral ground for them to stand on here - they're in the same category as any other spammer. Furthermore nowhere did OP advocate deliberately expanding the scope to their family. If phone calls at inconvenient-to-them times end up bothering their family as well, it's because they didn't do the work to separate their family from their ugly business. In general I don't buy into the idea of declaring some times as off limits for phone calls, since society has never given me the same courtesy in the early morning. I'd much rather get calls at 10PM than 10AM, and yet it's somehow acceptable for businesses to return an afternoon call at 9AM sharp and pretend they're doing their best to communicate.

chrisseaton 5y ago
A lot of words to justify that you know you’ll likely be impacting someone who did nothing against you.
- mindslight 5y ago
  I'm sure many more words have been written by legal nastygrammers justifying their own actions of unsolicited aggression.
  - chrisseaton 5y ago
    Shouldn't we aim to have better moral standards than them when dealing with third parties? I'm just absolutely dumfounded that someone is seriously suggesting harassing a wife and children over a business relationship and repeatedly trying to justify it.
    - mindslight 5y ago
      In general? Sure. When dealing with hostile unwanted contact? Not particularly. Nobody here has advocated harassing someone's wife or children. That's a straw man you created.
      - chrisseaton 5y ago
        > If phone calls at inconvenient-to-them times end up bothering their family as well, it's because they didn't do the work to separate their family from their ugly business. Real ‘nice family you have there, shame if someone would scare them with a few calls at 2am’ vibe there, and you know it.
        mindslight 5y ago
        It's more like don't harass people and then expect having a family will shield you from the repercussions. These nastygram shakedowns deliberately cause personal stress to their victims (there is little other reason to send baseless legal demands), and so escalating the situation to be personally stressful for the attackers seems like an appropriate response. As far as I can tell you're arguing that it's one thing to harass people during "business hours", but there is some greater principle whereby harassing them back at off hours is wrong because it might bother their personal associates. If you don't want to get phone calls at inconvenient times either don't be a shithead in the first place (so that people calling you respect your schedule), or figure out how to silence your phones.