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Do employees pay some % to the unions? In our country unions are useless and are created to make their leaders rich but not the people they represent.

by lewich 5y ago

umvi 5y ago
Yes, Union dues are usually automatically subtracted from paychecks
- ocdtrekkie 5y ago
  The key difference though is that statistically, unionized employees are paid more than non-unionized employees... so much so that the union dues are significantly less than the increased pay from collective bargaining.
  - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
    On average. Top performers often see compensation fall. For industries where “top performer” isn’t a thing because the labor is commoditised, that doesn’t matter. But for some domains it does.
    - arvinsim 5y ago
      I wonder how much being a top performer matter in game development when there is a glut in supply.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
    - danaris 5y ago
      The problem is, far too many programmers think they're "top performers" who deserve to be paid way more than the guy in the next cubicle over—far, far more than can possibly be the case, mathematically speaking. Personally, even if I believed myself to be the mythical 10x developer, I would still advocate for unions, because a) Unions help with more than just pay; they make working conditions and benefits vastly better b) I care about the people around me being paid fairly, too c) If I'm genuinely good enough to be at the top of whatever pay scale there ends up being, I'm confident that a union will make sure that's enough money to live comfortably, and that's all I need. I have negative interest in ever having a lifestyle in which the difference between $150k/yr and $200k/yr actually affects what I can do for myself or how I can live.
    - ryandrake 5y ago
      I think a lot of the reasons unions in tech fail to materialize is that every employee sees themself as in the "top performer" group and therefore imagines his or her compensation decreasing in a union. Do a survey of a company's software engineers and ask them if they believe they are among the top 1% of performers in their company. I bet more than 15% say YES. There are many more below-average comps in tech than above average, because the high end skews really high. So the majority of tech workers should actually see more compensation when negotiating collectively.
    - kreeben 5y ago
      >> Top performers often see compensation fall. Absolutely not true. I have only anecdotal evidence: I live and work in a nation where unions are everywhere and I see rockstars and specialists getting paid way more than their team mates, everywhere I look. Can you supply any evidence to support your claim that top performers often see compensation fall?
    - kennywinker 5y ago
      Many pro sports have a players union, and yet top performers seem to get pretty generous deals there…
chrisgd 5y ago
Sounds like a Blizzard talking point. Unions have done a great job, on average, of improving wages and conditions for their workers. Better healthcare benefits through an employer typically more than makes up for the cost of the union dues.
bastardoperator 5y ago
Which country is this? Also your comment is a common/untrue talking point when it comes to anti-union rhetoric and union busting. The reality is people working union jobs in the US tend to have better benefits, get paid more, and have a lot more job security.

Do employees pay some % to the unions? In our country unions are useless and are created to make their leaders rich but not the people they represent.

by lewich 5y ago

Do employees pay some % to the unions? In our country unions are useless and are created to make their leaders rich but not the people they represent.

umvi 5y ago

Yes, Union dues are usually automatically subtracted from paychecks

ocdtrekkie 5y ago
The key difference though is that statistically, unionized employees are paid more than non-unionized employees... so much so that the union dues are significantly less than the increased pay from collective bargaining.
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago
  On average. Top performers often see compensation fall. For industries where “top performer” isn’t a thing because the labor is commoditised, that doesn’t matter. But for some domains it does.
  - arvinsim 5y ago
    I wonder how much being a top performer matter in game development when there is a glut in supply.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - danaris 5y ago
    The problem is, far too many programmers think they're "top performers" who deserve to be paid way more than the guy in the next cubicle over—far, far more than can possibly be the case, mathematically speaking. Personally, even if I believed myself to be the mythical 10x developer, I would still advocate for unions, because a) Unions help with more than just pay; they make working conditions and benefits vastly better b) I care about the people around me being paid fairly, too c) If I'm genuinely good enough to be at the top of whatever pay scale there ends up being, I'm confident that a union will make sure that's enough money to live comfortably, and that's all I need. I have negative interest in ever having a lifestyle in which the difference between $150k/yr and $200k/yr actually affects what I can do for myself or how I can live.
  - ryandrake 5y ago
    I think a lot of the reasons unions in tech fail to materialize is that every employee sees themself as in the "top performer" group and therefore imagines his or her compensation decreasing in a union. Do a survey of a company's software engineers and ask them if they believe they are among the top 1% of performers in their company. I bet more than 15% say YES. There are many more below-average comps in tech than above average, because the high end skews really high. So the majority of tech workers should actually see more compensation when negotiating collectively.
  - kreeben 5y ago
    >> Top performers often see compensation fall. Absolutely not true. I have only anecdotal evidence: I live and work in a nation where unions are everywhere and I see rockstars and specialists getting paid way more than their team mates, everywhere I look. Can you supply any evidence to support your claim that top performers often see compensation fall?
  - kennywinker 5y ago
    Many pro sports have a players union, and yet top performers seem to get pretty generous deals there…

chrisgd 5y ago

Sounds like a Blizzard talking point. Unions have done a great job, on average, of improving wages and conditions for their workers. Better healthcare benefits through an employer typically more than makes up for the cost of the union dues.

bastardoperator 5y ago

Which country is this? Also your comment is a common/untrue talking point when it comes to anti-union rhetoric and union busting. The reality is people working union jobs in the US tend to have better benefits, get paid more, and have a lot more job security.