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1) Why do people buy "pro" apps to remove ads but would not do that for content on the web? Also the micro fraud argument is kinda funny since everyone knows th

by noxer 5y ago

1) Why do people buy "pro" apps to remove ads but would not do that for content on the web? Also the micro fraud argument is kinda funny since everyone knows the ad business is full or fraud and everyone somehow involved with ads pays a huge junk for this. I think micropayment is far move fraud resistant because all the bots pretending to be humans and clicking ads do not work anymore. 2) That true. but it doesn't have to be a blockchain in fact there is already proposed protocols to do micropayment on global scale its called Interledger Protocol (ILP). Its a protocol like TCP/IP it scales the same way. And as the name suggest it can be used with multiple ledgers including blockchains but it doesn't have to be one.

pjc50 5y ago
> remove ads but would not do that for content on the web The "pro" app equivalent is existing paywalls, NYT-style. > micropayment is far move fraud resistant because all the bots pretending to be humans and clicking ads do not work anymore But different sorts of fraud are imaginable, especially if you don't confirm every single payment. If you do confirm every single payment that's probably unacceptable user friction. Or the copyright problem already seen with NFTs and content farms: copy someone else's pages, charge for access to them.
- noxer 5y ago
  Paywalls are walled gardens even if I would want to use them I cant because the internet is global but paywalls are not. Beside that its not feasible as paywalls are usually a subscription, the average user would need to have 10-100 subscriptions to cover their browsing habit. Not only is this way to expensive its also completely impractical. And it would self inflict a incentive to not leave your subscription bubble. Micropayment make it possible that I can pay without subscription without giving my personal data and without some absurd premium price that is justified by the fact that I could consume other stuff for the rest of the month/year which I likely dont want. >But different sorts of fraud are imaginable Sure and we find solutions for these. Unlike with ads everyone should be onboard blocking and fighting the fraud. with ads however thous who dont commit it can still profit from it. >If you do confirm every single payment that's probably unacceptable But there are solutions for these problems. Lets say you want to watch a youtube video, it could be free for the first 10% and then ask you to confirm payment. Then it steams payment as you watch so if you stop halfway trough you only paid half the price. >Or the copyright problem already seen with NFTs There is no such NFT copyright problem its made up nonsense. People just dont understand what they buy usually a public price of art. So its already released when sold and people can copy or store it however they want. Its worthless just like an MP3 file of a radio hit is worthless the rights on that track however may not be worthless if the owner know how to make money from it. >copy someone else's pages, charge for access to them. Already possible now. Micropayments does not change anything here. People steal stuff and "sell" it. There is no technical solution for this problem.
manigandham 5y ago
Every model has been tried from standard subscriptions to bundled subscriptions (Mogul, Subscribd) to ads replacement (Google Contributor, Sterling) to pay-per-article (Blendle) and they've all found limited success. 1) Most people do not value written content and news the same as other forms of entertainment. 2) There's too much decision friction and it gets worse when you have to decide per article. 3) Ads subsidize far more than most people could afford to pay for directly. Crypto doesn't solve any of these human behavior or budget problems.
- noxer 5y ago
  Check out coil.com Also who said content has to be written? If the demand for written paid content is low there is no way to fix this. Demand for stuff changes over time and certain business go obsolete. This has nothing to do with the topic, those who dont adapt die out. No one claims that somehow crypto would magically make people earn money with stuff no one want to pay for. >3) Ads subsidize far more than most people could afford to pay for directly. That is mathematically impossible every ad is paid by thous who buy the product. Thous who just see ads but never buy factually dont pay and dont ad any value at all they just force thous who buy to pay more. There are many people who dont use ad-blockers because they think its the morally right thing to do, to support the content creators through ads. They make this logic mistake all the time. There is nothing morally right about raising the product pirce for others so ad companies get more revenue and a tiny but also goes to the content creator. Its a best Robin Hood like moral gymnastics, it does not ad value to the system and you dont pay for the content you consumes.

by noxer 5y ago

pjc50 5y ago

> remove ads but would not do that for content on the web The "pro" app equivalent is existing paywalls, NYT-style. > micropayment is far move fraud resistant because all the bots pretending to be humans and clicking ads do not work anymore But different sorts of fraud are imaginable, especially if you don't confirm every single payment. If you do confirm every single payment that's probably unacceptable user friction. Or the copyright problem already seen with NFTs and content farms: copy someone else's pages, charge for access to them.

noxer 5y ago
Paywalls are walled gardens even if I would want to use them I cant because the internet is global but paywalls are not. Beside that its not feasible as paywalls are usually a subscription, the average user would need to have 10-100 subscriptions to cover their browsing habit. Not only is this way to expensive its also completely impractical. And it would self inflict a incentive to not leave your subscription bubble. Micropayment make it possible that I can pay without subscription without giving my personal data and without some absurd premium price that is justified by the fact that I could consume other stuff for the rest of the month/year which I likely dont want. >But different sorts of fraud are imaginable Sure and we find solutions for these. Unlike with ads everyone should be onboard blocking and fighting the fraud. with ads however thous who dont commit it can still profit from it. >If you do confirm every single payment that's probably unacceptable But there are solutions for these problems. Lets say you want to watch a youtube video, it could be free for the first 10% and then ask you to confirm payment. Then it steams payment as you watch so if you stop halfway trough you only paid half the price. >Or the copyright problem already seen with NFTs There is no such NFT copyright problem its made up nonsense. People just dont understand what they buy usually a public price of art. So its already released when sold and people can copy or store it however they want. Its worthless just like an MP3 file of a radio hit is worthless the rights on that track however may not be worthless if the owner know how to make money from it. >copy someone else's pages, charge for access to them. Already possible now. Micropayments does not change anything here. People steal stuff and "sell" it. There is no technical solution for this problem.

manigandham 5y ago

Every model has been tried from standard subscriptions to bundled subscriptions (Mogul, Subscribd) to ads replacement (Google Contributor, Sterling) to pay-per-article (Blendle) and they've all found limited success. 1) Most people do not value written content and news the same as other forms of entertainment. 2) There's too much decision friction and it gets worse when you have to decide per article. 3) Ads subsidize far more than most people could afford to pay for directly. Crypto doesn't solve any of these human behavior or budget problems.

noxer 5y ago
Check out coil.com Also who said content has to be written? If the demand for written paid content is low there is no way to fix this. Demand for stuff changes over time and certain business go obsolete. This has nothing to do with the topic, those who dont adapt die out. No one claims that somehow crypto would magically make people earn money with stuff no one want to pay for. >3) Ads subsidize far more than most people could afford to pay for directly. That is mathematically impossible every ad is paid by thous who buy the product. Thous who just see ads but never buy factually dont pay and dont ad any value at all they just force thous who buy to pay more. There are many people who dont use ad-blockers because they think its the morally right thing to do, to support the content creators through ads. They make this logic mistake all the time. There is nothing morally right about raising the product pirce for others so ad companies get more revenue and a tiny but also goes to the content creator. Its a best Robin Hood like moral gymnastics, it does not ad value to the system and you dont pay for the content you consumes.