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Is there a reason why things get tangled so easily. Like it seems like its the way of the universe. I recently tried fly fishing. I spend 1/3 of the time tryin

Is there a reason why things get tangled so easily. Like it seems like its the way of the universe. I recently tried fly fishing. I spend 1/3 of the time trying to untangle my fishing line.

Jensson 5y ago
Probably entropy. If you randomize fishing line positions almost all of them would be tangled. Now putting the fishing line in a box isn't the same thing as randomizing it, but the point of entropy is that small random changes will move the state towards higher entropy, meaning that the random changes ought to move the line towards being tangled. Of course this assumes that a tangled line has higher entropy for some definition of entropy. Proving/structuring that would be too much work though, but if solved could make for a nice paper. Hmm, since it would be such a nice paper I looked it up, and apparently people have already studied these things: https://www.npr.org/sections/bryantpark/2008/01/knot_theory_why_everything_tan.html https://www.npr.org/sections/bryantpark/2008/01/knot_theory_...
- dukeofdoom 5y ago
  Thanks for the great reply! Fascinating
bamboozled 5y ago
Almost never happens to me, but it did when learning. So I think the reason it’s happening is you. All due respect. Edit: I’ll try be more constructive. There’s a good chance you’re looping your fly back over the line during your cast crating knots and tangles. I do agree stuff tangles easily but I don’t find it to be the case with fly lines in general.
- dukeofdoom 5y ago
  I'm definitely doing that. I'm using an amazon rod and reel combo deal by maxcatch, and it came with a very fine fishing line at the tip of the leader. So the wind picks it up, and loops it around the tip of the rod sometimes. But I also had snags inside the reel. And snags and tangles around bushes, and tree limbs.
version_five 5y ago
15 years ago on slashdot I read an article about this, basically as you say, it is entropy driven and tangled is a more natural state. I'll try and find it. I cant find it - there is a 2007 Science article but it's not what remember. Anyway, this link has a short summary and a couple other good links: http://uncommon-priors.com/?p=3437 http://uncommon-priors.com/?p=3437
- dukeofdoom 5y ago
  Thanks, really good read. Makes sense.
- SilasX 5y ago
  Yes, I remember it from then too! Oddly I also recall that part of the result was that 3 dimensions is a kind of sweet spot for cords to be prone to tangling — in 2 dimensions they can’t and in 4+ the state space too large for it to happen without really trying at it. But I don’t see that part of it in the link.
scheme271 5y ago
As others said, it's entropy. Basically, think about the ways that you can arrange your lines in a box. There's relatively few ways that you can arrange the lines so that they're neat and not all tangled up. There's a lot of ways that they can be tangled up. So if the lines get jostled and move a bit, it's more likely that they end up in a slightly more tangled arrangement than in a less tangled arrangement. Do this a bunch of times and your lines end up all tangled up.

Is there a reason why things get tangled so easily. Like it seems like its the way of the universe. I recently tried fly fishing. I spend 1/3 of the time trying to untangle my fishing line.

Jensson 5y ago

Probably entropy. If you randomize fishing line positions almost all of them would be tangled. Now putting the fishing line in a box isn't the same thing as randomizing it, but the point of entropy is that small random changes will move the state towards higher entropy, meaning that the random changes ought to move the line towards being tangled. Of course this assumes that a tangled line has higher entropy for some definition of entropy. Proving/structuring that would be too much work though, but if solved could make for a nice paper. Hmm, since it would be such a nice paper I looked it up, and apparently people have already studied these things: https://www.npr.org/sections/bryantpark/2008/01/knot_theory_why_everything_tan.html https://www.npr.org/sections/bryantpark/2008/01/knot_theory_...

dukeofdoom 5y ago
Thanks for the great reply! Fascinating

bamboozled 5y ago

Almost never happens to me, but it did when learning. So I think the reason it’s happening is you. All due respect. Edit: I’ll try be more constructive. There’s a good chance you’re looping your fly back over the line during your cast crating knots and tangles. I do agree stuff tangles easily but I don’t find it to be the case with fly lines in general.

dukeofdoom 5y ago
I'm definitely doing that. I'm using an amazon rod and reel combo deal by maxcatch, and it came with a very fine fishing line at the tip of the leader. So the wind picks it up, and loops it around the tip of the rod sometimes. But I also had snags inside the reel. And snags and tangles around bushes, and tree limbs.

version_five 5y ago

15 years ago on slashdot I read an article about this, basically as you say, it is entropy driven and tangled is a more natural state. I'll try and find it. I cant find it - there is a 2007 Science article but it's not what remember. Anyway, this link has a short summary and a couple other good links: http://uncommon-priors.com/?p=3437 http://uncommon-priors.com/?p=3437

dukeofdoom 5y ago
Thanks, really good read. Makes sense.
SilasX 5y ago
Yes, I remember it from then too! Oddly I also recall that part of the result was that 3 dimensions is a kind of sweet spot for cords to be prone to tangling — in 2 dimensions they can’t and in 4+ the state space too large for it to happen without really trying at it. But I don’t see that part of it in the link.

scheme271 5y ago

As others said, it's entropy. Basically, think about the ways that you can arrange your lines in a box. There's relatively few ways that you can arrange the lines so that they're neat and not all tangled up. There's a lot of ways that they can be tangled up. So if the lines get jostled and move a bit, it's more likely that they end up in a slightly more tangled arrangement than in a less tangled arrangement. Do this a bunch of times and your lines end up all tangled up.