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https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/ https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/ > We're tracking where taxpayer money has gone in the ongoing bailout of the

https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/ https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/ > We're tracking where taxpayer money has gone in the ongoing bailout of the financial system. Our database accounts for both the broader $700 billion bill and the separate bailout of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. > Altogether, accounting for both the TARP and the Fannie and Freddie bailout, $635B has gone out the door. Money has been coming back in two ways: $390B of principal has been repaid, and the Treasury has collected revenue from its investments of $353B. > In total, the government has realized a $109B profit as of August 30, 2021. I'm sure there are a lot of other hidden costs with the bailouts that aren't accounted for here, but it seems the companies that were specifically loaned money generally paid back more than what was given? If not, what else is missing here?

LordDragonfang 5y ago
>$635B has gone out the door [as of 2009] >$109B profit as of August 30, 2021 That's less than 1.5% average yearly ROI. That's a joke. An index fund, the least risky type of investment, has an average yearly interest rate of 10%. The stock market averages 8%. The irresponsible mortgages that got the banks into this situation had rates between twice and quadruple that. Hell, even inflation outpaces that on average. Accounting for inflation, that's not even an interest rate of 0%, that's a real interest rate in the negatives. The taxpayers paid for the bailout. Socialism for the rich, rugged capitalism for the poor.
- PeterisP 5y ago
  That's not an appropriate conclusion to make, as most of the money was returned a long time ago, not on 2021. For a random example, JPMorgan Chase got funding of $25B and returned it only some 8 months later (https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/entities/282-jpmorgan-chase); https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/entities/282-jpmorga... the gov't earned some 1.7B on it which comes out to an annualized interest rate of approximately 10%.
  - cudgy 5y ago
    25 Billion out of the nearly 700 Billion from a bank that didn’t need the money proves that “most of the money was returned long ago”? Not very convincing. JPMorgan was actively buying up assets in 2008 and were one of the banks that was well capitalized. “JPMorgan Chase did not want or need TARP money, but we recognized that if the healthy banks did not take it, no one else could — out of fear that the market would lose confidence in them.” https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/economy/2018/09/14/jamie-dimon-jp-morgan-memo-actions-financial-crisis/1304253002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/economy/2018/09/14/jami...
- ChrisLomont 5y ago
  Taxpayers paid zero. What year exactly were taxes tripled to cover the amount loaned? Never? It didn't happen. Taxpayers realized significant profits on the loans, since by law Fed profits past a small amount return to Treasury, which offsets taxes.
  - cudgy 5y ago
    It’s called deficit spending. No need to raise taxes now; defer it to future generations.
    - ChrisLomont 5y ago
      The money did not come from Treasury. It's not called deficit spending, which comes from loans from the Treasury. And they were loans, as well documented in this thread. Paid back with interest. Do you know the difference between the Fed and Treasury?

LordDragonfang 5y ago

>$635B has gone out the door [as of 2009] >$109B profit as of August 30, 2021 That's less than 1.5% average yearly ROI. That's a joke. An index fund, the least risky type of investment, has an average yearly interest rate of 10%. The stock market averages 8%. The irresponsible mortgages that got the banks into this situation had rates between twice and quadruple that. Hell, even inflation outpaces that on average. Accounting for inflation, that's not even an interest rate of 0%, that's a real interest rate in the negatives. The taxpayers paid for the bailout. Socialism for the rich, rugged capitalism for the poor.

PeterisP 5y ago
That's not an appropriate conclusion to make, as most of the money was returned a long time ago, not on 2021. For a random example, JPMorgan Chase got funding of $25B and returned it only some 8 months later (https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/entities/282-jpmorgan-chase); https://projects.propublica.org/bailout/entities/282-jpmorga... the gov't earned some 1.7B on it which comes out to an annualized interest rate of approximately 10%.
- cudgy 5y ago
  25 Billion out of the nearly 700 Billion from a bank that didn’t need the money proves that “most of the money was returned long ago”? Not very convincing. JPMorgan was actively buying up assets in 2008 and were one of the banks that was well capitalized. “JPMorgan Chase did not want or need TARP money, but we recognized that if the healthy banks did not take it, no one else could — out of fear that the market would lose confidence in them.” https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/economy/2018/09/14/jamie-dimon-jp-morgan-memo-actions-financial-crisis/1304253002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/economy/2018/09/14/jami...
ChrisLomont 5y ago
Taxpayers paid zero. What year exactly were taxes tripled to cover the amount loaned? Never? It didn't happen. Taxpayers realized significant profits on the loans, since by law Fed profits past a small amount return to Treasury, which offsets taxes.
- cudgy 5y ago
  It’s called deficit spending. No need to raise taxes now; defer it to future generations.
  - ChrisLomont 5y ago
    The money did not come from Treasury. It's not called deficit spending, which comes from loans from the Treasury. And they were loans, as well documented in this thread. Paid back with interest. Do you know the difference between the Fed and Treasury?