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Anecdotally a _lot_ of people I know have become significantly less civic minded as a result of the way that coronavirus has been handled. Basically, they figu

Anecdotally a _lot_ of people I know have become significantly less civic minded as a result of the way that coronavirus has been handled. Basically, they figure, well, the law became insane (lockdowns, business restrictions, silly rules, general kafkaesque atmosphere) - why should I give a toss any more. If it's illegal to visit your mum and you break the law for that, suddenly a lot of previously verboten activities are open.

version_five 5y ago
There is the whole thing about how society starts to break down once norms get ignored. Normally this gets brought up in relation to some right wing populist thing, but it applies equally to the way governments all around the world have thrown away any notion of personal freedom over the last two years. Covid hystericism is not going to be without consequence.
- GekkePrutser 5y ago
  Agreed. I definitely take the government less seriously now. And I was a socialist before this happened. But there must be a balance. Especially the first lockdown when we needed a piece of paper with a reason to go out. I know some measures were needed but the heavy-handedness was crazy and in some ways still is. If it had been ebola on the loose I would have understood. Especially now that most of us are vaccinated (yes me too). It made me do more risky things like get a tattoo which I've always kinda wanted, and not really care about seatbelts anymore. For me the reason is mainly that I don't care as much for the quality of life that's left now with masks and QR codes and constant vigilance so I don't really care as much if I'd die in a car crash. But I'm not sure if that reasoning applies to everyone. But I think it's also that we can't care about so many things all the time. They added a huge load of new things to worry about and I think it's natural that others will suffer. Like road safety and the environment.
  - kcb 5y ago
    Since you were level headed enough to make this comment, don't you think some introspection is in order? Come on now. Mask Requirement -> Might as well die in a car crash, that doesn't sound particularly sane.
    - GekkePrutser 5y ago
      Well what I didn't mention is that I had a childhood illness that caused me to almost suffocate several times. Because of this I'm extremely sensitive to anything interfering with my respiration and especially high humidity (because the treatment involved breathing steam). For me it feels awful to wear a mask and gives me constant anxiety, especially after an hour or so. Once the situation is more stable I want to move to a place that doesn't mandate them but it is a big worry and uncertainty and that makes me depressed. Anyway it's kind of personal that's why I didn't mention this. I wear the mask where needed but I'm afraid they will become the norm because that would really hurt me. I feel left out of society. But I think other people do too, just with different specifics. I also said I cared less. It's not that I don't care at all. It just shifted things down a bit on the scale of importance if you know what I mean. Before I would wear a seatbelt even when parking the car around the block, now I wouldn't bother. For a longer trip I still would.
    - version_five 5y ago
      You can pretend it doesn't make a difference, but restricting people is not "free". That's the whole point of the article - make peoples lives worse and take away their agency and they will act accordingly. Repeating "it's not a big deal" about the restrictions doesn't change anything
  - gota 5y ago
    If you are not convinced of the benefits to yourself of using a seatbelt at this point I don't think you can claim your positions to be rational It's ok to have emotional, irrational, positions. But you are better off knowing that is what they are
    - carlmr 5y ago
      I think that's why he brought up this example. He knows it's irrational.
    - lupire 5y ago
      As parent said, If you don't want to live, wearing seatbelt isn't rational.
  - ryandrake 5y ago
    USA here, I trust the government less now but for the opposite reason: when it came down to actually enforcing covid restrictions during this disaster, they utterly failed. Everyone was out horsing around, shopping, dining out, ignoring the mandates, and there was zero enforcement. Everything was half assed and even the politicians were flouting the rules. All talk and no action.
    - joshuahughes 5y ago
      “Everyone was out horsing around, shopping, dining out, ignoring the mandates, and there was zero enforcement. Everything was half assed and even the politicians were flouting the rules. All talk and no action.” That’s because everyone can see now that there are no bodies piling up in the streets, and while hospitals are busy they’ve still not been truly overwhelmed - even though we’ve been repeatedly told that they would be for 20 months. Life is too precious to let it slip by without living. As for the lack of enforcement, good! If politicians go the “do as I say, not as I do” route, there’d be civil unrest, and rightfully so.
      - sul_tasto 5y ago
        I agree with you, but why all the posturing by the politicians? That’s what I don’t understand.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]

version_five 5y ago

There is the whole thing about how society starts to break down once norms get ignored. Normally this gets brought up in relation to some right wing populist thing, but it applies equally to the way governments all around the world have thrown away any notion of personal freedom over the last two years. Covid hystericism is not going to be without consequence.

GekkePrutser 5y ago
Agreed. I definitely take the government less seriously now. And I was a socialist before this happened. But there must be a balance. Especially the first lockdown when we needed a piece of paper with a reason to go out. I know some measures were needed but the heavy-handedness was crazy and in some ways still is. If it had been ebola on the loose I would have understood. Especially now that most of us are vaccinated (yes me too). It made me do more risky things like get a tattoo which I've always kinda wanted, and not really care about seatbelts anymore. For me the reason is mainly that I don't care as much for the quality of life that's left now with masks and QR codes and constant vigilance so I don't really care as much if I'd die in a car crash. But I'm not sure if that reasoning applies to everyone. But I think it's also that we can't care about so many things all the time. They added a huge load of new things to worry about and I think it's natural that others will suffer. Like road safety and the environment.
- kcb 5y ago
  Since you were level headed enough to make this comment, don't you think some introspection is in order? Come on now. Mask Requirement -> Might as well die in a car crash, that doesn't sound particularly sane.
  - GekkePrutser 5y ago
    Well what I didn't mention is that I had a childhood illness that caused me to almost suffocate several times. Because of this I'm extremely sensitive to anything interfering with my respiration and especially high humidity (because the treatment involved breathing steam). For me it feels awful to wear a mask and gives me constant anxiety, especially after an hour or so. Once the situation is more stable I want to move to a place that doesn't mandate them but it is a big worry and uncertainty and that makes me depressed. Anyway it's kind of personal that's why I didn't mention this. I wear the mask where needed but I'm afraid they will become the norm because that would really hurt me. I feel left out of society. But I think other people do too, just with different specifics. I also said I cared less. It's not that I don't care at all. It just shifted things down a bit on the scale of importance if you know what I mean. Before I would wear a seatbelt even when parking the car around the block, now I wouldn't bother. For a longer trip I still would.
  - version_five 5y ago
    You can pretend it doesn't make a difference, but restricting people is not "free". That's the whole point of the article - make peoples lives worse and take away their agency and they will act accordingly. Repeating "it's not a big deal" about the restrictions doesn't change anything
- gota 5y ago
  If you are not convinced of the benefits to yourself of using a seatbelt at this point I don't think you can claim your positions to be rational It's ok to have emotional, irrational, positions. But you are better off knowing that is what they are
  - carlmr 5y ago
    I think that's why he brought up this example. He knows it's irrational.
  - lupire 5y ago
    As parent said, If you don't want to live, wearing seatbelt isn't rational.
- ryandrake 5y ago
  USA here, I trust the government less now but for the opposite reason: when it came down to actually enforcing covid restrictions during this disaster, they utterly failed. Everyone was out horsing around, shopping, dining out, ignoring the mandates, and there was zero enforcement. Everything was half assed and even the politicians were flouting the rules. All talk and no action.
  - joshuahughes 5y ago
    “Everyone was out horsing around, shopping, dining out, ignoring the mandates, and there was zero enforcement. Everything was half assed and even the politicians were flouting the rules. All talk and no action.” That’s because everyone can see now that there are no bodies piling up in the streets, and while hospitals are busy they’ve still not been truly overwhelmed - even though we’ve been repeatedly told that they would be for 20 months. Life is too precious to let it slip by without living. As for the lack of enforcement, good! If politicians go the “do as I say, not as I do” route, there’d be civil unrest, and rightfully so.
    - sul_tasto 5y ago
      I agree with you, but why all the posturing by the politicians? That’s what I don’t understand.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]