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We need better definitions then. Apple uses 1440p/1600p on laptop screens. At normal viewing distances using that on a 14" laptop and 4K on a 27 inch external s

We need better definitions then. Apple uses 1440p/1600p on laptop screens. At normal viewing distances using that on a 14" laptop and 4K on a 27 inch external screen works perfectly with the same scaling. I know because that's what I use with just font scaling that's the same across screens. With my work 14" 1080p Windows laptop 2x scaling is needed on the external screen. If 4K 27" is not HiDPI what do we call 1080p in that size which is still the normal resolution for those screens?

radley 5y ago
4K 24" will be HiDPI because it's 2x 1080p. 5k 27" is HiDPI, because it 2x the old 1440 screens.
- pedrocr 5y ago
  4K 27" is also 2x1080p. 1080p panels come in all sizes, including 27". And Apple uses 1600p on their laptops, when most laptops these days are 1080p. I guess Apple laptops are also not HiDPI as 1600p is not 2x1080p. Angular resolutions matter much more than surface DPI. You don't use a 27" screen at the same distance as a 24" one the same way you don't use a 14" laptop screen the same distance as your phone.
  - 4ad 5y ago
    Yes, angular resolution is all that matters, which is why their small displays are now 254ppi, while the iMac and the Pro XDR is 218ppi.
    - pedrocr 5y ago
      Don't take it from me, you can read Steve Jobs himself on the introduction of the Retina term: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retina_display#Rationale https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retina_display#Rationale
      - 4ad 5y ago
        Do you really believe that people use these 4k@27'' displays at a different distance than mac users use their 27 inch iMac?
        pedrocr 5y ago
        I use a 4K 27" screen at a distance where it uses the same scaling as a 1440p 14" laptop. Looks great to me, but if your vision is better or you're using it closer then it may not be enough. Other people use 4K TVs or 65" screens to be able to set them farther and keep their vision more rested for the same angular resolution. Resolution requirements depend massively on how you setup your workspace and the quality of your vision. There are plenty of people that use software scaling for 1080p 14" laptop screens as they consider normal sizes too small for example. The range of configurations is very high and you're on one extreme of that range. There's nothing wrong with that but that's probably why you're frustrated with the lack of options on the market. For most people even 4K 27" is already overkill and 1080p external screens sell well instead.
        4ad 5y ago
        Please answer the question I posted. "Do you really believe that people use these 4k@27'' displays at a different distance than mac users use their 27 inch iMac?"
        pedrocr 5y ago
        Yes. I do believe an external 4k 27" on a laptop is used differently than a single screen on an iMac. I also believe people use iMacs in ways that are different than what you use, which was the whole point of my answer. People use screens in all sorts of different ways. Most of them have resolution requirements much below yours, which is why the market apparently doesn't cater for your needs.
        aulin 5y ago
        For most people not using macos 4k is overkill and 1080p can be enough not by itself but because the other two major OS (windows and linux) have antialiased text with subpixel hinting. I.e. they can exploit the pixel internal structure to display sharp text even on low resolution monitors. Apple deliberately decided to ditch their own implementation as you don't need it for retina displays and they only sell and care about retina displays.
4ad 5y ago
> We need better definitions then. We have a definition, it's ppi, and you need at least 220ppi. > Apple uses 1440p/1600p on laptop screens. No, it doesn't. The current 14'' screen is 3024x1964 and the current 16 inch is 3456x2234 (both 254ppi). The previous generation used about 220ppi displays.
- pedrocr 5y ago
  The current 13.3" screens are 1600p, the original Retina displays were also 1800p on 15". Only the last generation is a little higher and still not 4K like in PCs. Apple itself has always branded "Retina" based on angular resolution and not surface density, so viewing distance makes a huge difference.
  - 4ad 5y ago
    No, their 13'' screens have been 2560x1600 (226ppi) since 2012. You are confused because the nomenclature like 1080p refers to vertical resolution while 4k refers to horizontal resolution.
    - pedrocr 5y ago
      No to what? I know what 1080p/1600p/1800p is. Here's a direct quote from the Macbook Air tech specs: Retina display: 13.3-inch (diagonal) LED-backlit display with IPS technology; 2560-by-1600 native resolution If 1600p on 13" is not Retina you need to argue this with Apple instead.
      - 4ad 5y ago
        > If 1600p on 13" is not Retina you need to argue this with Apple instead. It's 226ppi display. Why would it not be a retina display?
        detaro 5y ago
        1280x720: 720p 1920x1080: 1080p 2560x1440: 1440p 2560x1600: ... EDIT: if you're going to edit your comment once called out on talking nonsense, at least have the decency to note it.

radley 5y ago

4K 24" will be HiDPI because it's 2x 1080p. 5k 27" is HiDPI, because it 2x the old 1440 screens.

pedrocr 5y ago
4K 27" is also 2x1080p. 1080p panels come in all sizes, including 27". And Apple uses 1600p on their laptops, when most laptops these days are 1080p. I guess Apple laptops are also not HiDPI as 1600p is not 2x1080p. Angular resolutions matter much more than surface DPI. You don't use a 27" screen at the same distance as a 24" one the same way you don't use a 14" laptop screen the same distance as your phone.
- 4ad 5y ago
  Yes, angular resolution is all that matters, which is why their small displays are now 254ppi, while the iMac and the Pro XDR is 218ppi.
  - pedrocr 5y ago
    Don't take it from me, you can read Steve Jobs himself on the introduction of the Retina term: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retina_display#Rationale https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retina_display#Rationale
    - 4ad 5y ago
      Do you really believe that people use these 4k@27'' displays at a different distance than mac users use their 27 inch iMac?
      - pedrocr 5y ago
        I use a 4K 27" screen at a distance where it uses the same scaling as a 1440p 14" laptop. Looks great to me, but if your vision is better or you're using it closer then it may not be enough. Other people use 4K TVs or 65" screens to be able to set them farther and keep their vision more rested for the same angular resolution. Resolution requirements depend massively on how you setup your workspace and the quality of your vision. There are plenty of people that use software scaling for 1080p 14" laptop screens as they consider normal sizes too small for example. The range of configurations is very high and you're on one extreme of that range. There's nothing wrong with that but that's probably why you're frustrated with the lack of options on the market. For most people even 4K 27" is already overkill and 1080p external screens sell well instead.
        4ad 5y ago
        Please answer the question I posted. "Do you really believe that people use these 4k@27'' displays at a different distance than mac users use their 27 inch iMac?"
        pedrocr 5y ago
        Yes. I do believe an external 4k 27" on a laptop is used differently than a single screen on an iMac. I also believe people use iMacs in ways that are different than what you use, which was the whole point of my answer. People use screens in all sorts of different ways. Most of them have resolution requirements much below yours, which is why the market apparently doesn't cater for your needs.
        aulin 5y ago
        For most people not using macos 4k is overkill and 1080p can be enough not by itself but because the other two major OS (windows and linux) have antialiased text with subpixel hinting. I.e. they can exploit the pixel internal structure to display sharp text even on low resolution monitors. Apple deliberately decided to ditch their own implementation as you don't need it for retina displays and they only sell and care about retina displays.

4ad 5y ago

> We need better definitions then. We have a definition, it's ppi, and you need at least 220ppi. > Apple uses 1440p/1600p on laptop screens. No, it doesn't. The current 14'' screen is 3024x1964 and the current 16 inch is 3456x2234 (both 254ppi). The previous generation used about 220ppi displays.

pedrocr 5y ago
The current 13.3" screens are 1600p, the original Retina displays were also 1800p on 15". Only the last generation is a little higher and still not 4K like in PCs. Apple itself has always branded "Retina" based on angular resolution and not surface density, so viewing distance makes a huge difference.
- 4ad 5y ago
  No, their 13'' screens have been 2560x1600 (226ppi) since 2012. You are confused because the nomenclature like 1080p refers to vertical resolution while 4k refers to horizontal resolution.
  - pedrocr 5y ago
    No to what? I know what 1080p/1600p/1800p is. Here's a direct quote from the Macbook Air tech specs: Retina display: 13.3-inch (diagonal) LED-backlit display with IPS technology; 2560-by-1600 native resolution If 1600p on 13" is not Retina you need to argue this with Apple instead.
    - 4ad 5y ago
      > If 1600p on 13" is not Retina you need to argue this with Apple instead. It's 226ppi display. Why would it not be a retina display?
      - detaro 5y ago
        1280x720: 720p 1920x1080: 1080p 2560x1440: 1440p 2560x1600: ... EDIT: if you're going to edit your comment once called out on talking nonsense, at least have the decency to note it.