15 ms·

Awesome. Now I can do my robotics programming in the best IDE in existence. Sorry, Eclipse, I love you and we're great together, but you're no Visual Studio.

blibble 15y ago
and VS is no IDEA, which also has Python support!
- silverbax88 15y ago
  You mean IntelliJIDEA, right? That intellisense is really nice, I loved it when I saw it VS too. Get a kick out of Java devs who think it's new. Sorry, not trying to bust on you, but I write in all these IDEs...I still love VS. But hey, C# is just a copy of Java, so maybe it evens out.
  - innes 15y ago
    I haven't used IntelliJIDEA, but I do use Jetbrains' Resharper, which transforms VS into a much better IDE. If that's anything to go by, IntelliJIDEA's intellisense will be better than VS's intellisense. Having said that, I just watched the screencast[1] of Python intellisense in VS, very impressive. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CoGsSlrxKk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CoGsSlrxKk
- WayneDB 15y ago
  IDEA's Python support seems very poor compared to VS. I installed the IDEA Python plugin and when I typed "import " it said "no suggestions". Same thing when I typed "sys." and when I created a new Python project, it couldn't find any interpreters installed on my system. Meanwhile in VS, after installing the Python plugin all of that stuff just worked the first time.
  - rufugee 15y ago
    When you start up a new Pycharm project or add a new interpreter, you have to let the index processes run (there's an indicator in the lower toolbar which will tell you when background processes are running...click it). When those index processes are finished, Pycharm will definitely autocomplete import statements: http://imgur.com/JRsfH http://imgur.com/JRsfH
    - joxn 15y ago
      To be fair, you have to do the same for PTVS, and we dont' have such a nice UI to tell you the index processes are running.
    - WayneDB 15y ago
      I configured an interpreter and things started working in IDEA (I don't have PyCharm). However, my assessment remains the same because now that autocomplete is finally working, it's still not as good as VS in my opinion. 1) VS shows documentation for each function in the autocomplete list. (Seen here http://i.imgur.com/wQpZZ.png http://i.imgur.com/wQpZZ.png ) IDEA does not. 2) VS shows type information where possible. IDEA does not. 3) VS shows the autocomplete list immediately after I type the space in "import ". With IDEA I have to hit Ctrl+Space to get the list. 4) The VS Python plugin worked with zero configuration. I had to configure an interpreter for IDEA and then wait a while for it to index everything.
      - nek4life 15y ago
        What version of IDEA do you have? The latest version 10.5 works with the new version of the python plugin (which is basicaly pycharm) and auto completes right away when you start typing. I really don't like having to configure the interpreters but it's also nice when you're using project based virtual environments.
francoisdevlin 15y ago
You spelled vi wrong
- mahmud 15y ago
  I don't see "vi-mode" in my site-lisp.
  - thurn 15y ago
    I don't see "site-lisp" on my quantum programming butterfly.
    - rbanffy 15y ago
      It's there. And it isn't.
- sigstop 15y ago
  I'm sure this was meant as a joke, but, the downmods still make me sad. I used VS for some classes in school and at my first job and it made me a worse programmer. It took years to undo the damage. In my opinion, as a developer, and in my experience in working with a lot of other developers, terminal + vim + build tools (gcc/javac/python, etc) is far superior compared to VS.
  - silverbax88 15y ago
    I'd be curious as to what 'damage' you needed to have undone. I've written in just about every IDE available (including vim) and quite frankly my opinion is that, well, tools can make things easier but they won't make anyone a good programmer.
    - sigstop 15y ago
      The debugger is a big one. I had a terrible habit of not thinking through the code but just running through the debugger until I got it working. Not thinking about how code looks (especially to other people) since I could just resize the window to whatever. A lot of the build complexities were hidden, which was fine as long as everything worked, but, as soon as something small broke, I spent days reading documentation and uselessly searching MSDN and the web trying to get the project to build (so, not understanding my build environment is something else I had to fix). There are lots more (source control, collaboration, etc). I know that switching my tools and my development environment made me a better programmer.

blibble 15y ago

and VS is no IDEA, which also has Python support!

silverbax88 15y ago
You mean IntelliJIDEA, right? That intellisense is really nice, I loved it when I saw it VS too. Get a kick out of Java devs who think it's new. Sorry, not trying to bust on you, but I write in all these IDEs...I still love VS. But hey, C# is just a copy of Java, so maybe it evens out.
- innes 15y ago
  I haven't used IntelliJIDEA, but I do use Jetbrains' Resharper, which transforms VS into a much better IDE. If that's anything to go by, IntelliJIDEA's intellisense will be better than VS's intellisense. Having said that, I just watched the screencast[1] of Python intellisense in VS, very impressive. [1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CoGsSlrxKk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CoGsSlrxKk
WayneDB 15y ago
IDEA's Python support seems very poor compared to VS. I installed the IDEA Python plugin and when I typed "import " it said "no suggestions". Same thing when I typed "sys." and when I created a new Python project, it couldn't find any interpreters installed on my system. Meanwhile in VS, after installing the Python plugin all of that stuff just worked the first time.
- rufugee 15y ago
  When you start up a new Pycharm project or add a new interpreter, you have to let the index processes run (there's an indicator in the lower toolbar which will tell you when background processes are running...click it). When those index processes are finished, Pycharm will definitely autocomplete import statements: http://imgur.com/JRsfH http://imgur.com/JRsfH
  - joxn 15y ago
    To be fair, you have to do the same for PTVS, and we dont' have such a nice UI to tell you the index processes are running.
  - WayneDB 15y ago
    I configured an interpreter and things started working in IDEA (I don't have PyCharm). However, my assessment remains the same because now that autocomplete is finally working, it's still not as good as VS in my opinion. 1) VS shows documentation for each function in the autocomplete list. (Seen here http://i.imgur.com/wQpZZ.png http://i.imgur.com/wQpZZ.png ) IDEA does not. 2) VS shows type information where possible. IDEA does not. 3) VS shows the autocomplete list immediately after I type the space in "import ". With IDEA I have to hit Ctrl+Space to get the list. 4) The VS Python plugin worked with zero configuration. I had to configure an interpreter for IDEA and then wait a while for it to index everything.
    - nek4life 15y ago
      What version of IDEA do you have? The latest version 10.5 works with the new version of the python plugin (which is basicaly pycharm) and auto completes right away when you start typing. I really don't like having to configure the interpreters but it's also nice when you're using project based virtual environments.

francoisdevlin 15y ago

You spelled vi wrong

mahmud 15y ago
I don't see "vi-mode" in my site-lisp.
- thurn 15y ago
  I don't see "site-lisp" on my quantum programming butterfly.
  - rbanffy 15y ago
    It's there. And it isn't.
sigstop 15y ago
I'm sure this was meant as a joke, but, the downmods still make me sad. I used VS for some classes in school and at my first job and it made me a worse programmer. It took years to undo the damage. In my opinion, as a developer, and in my experience in working with a lot of other developers, terminal + vim + build tools (gcc/javac/python, etc) is far superior compared to VS.
- silverbax88 15y ago
  I'd be curious as to what 'damage' you needed to have undone. I've written in just about every IDE available (including vim) and quite frankly my opinion is that, well, tools can make things easier but they won't make anyone a good programmer.
  - sigstop 15y ago
    The debugger is a big one. I had a terrible habit of not thinking through the code but just running through the debugger until I got it working. Not thinking about how code looks (especially to other people) since I could just resize the window to whatever. A lot of the build complexities were hidden, which was fine as long as everything worked, but, as soon as something small broke, I spent days reading documentation and uselessly searching MSDN and the web trying to get the project to build (so, not understanding my build environment is something else I had to fix). There are lots more (source control, collaboration, etc). I know that switching my tools and my development environment made me a better programmer.