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And you also have to do neither on linux. Also, just to compare apples to apples. If you buy a laptop with macos or linux preinstalled you of course have to do

And you also have to do neither on linux. Also, just to compare apples to apples. If you buy a laptop with macos or linux preinstalled you of course have to do nothing because someone else did it for you. Install macos on a dell laptop and tell us how easy that was.

neatze 5y ago
> And you also have to do neither on linux. what makes you say this ?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- rhn_mk1 5y ago
  Experience? If you buy a computer with Linux on it, you don't have to care.
- pgcj_poster 5y ago
  I've ran Linux on 6 different consumer laptops, and I've never had to configure a sound driver. I have had to choose a file system, but only on Arch and Debian, which are targeted toward advanced users.
newsbinator 5y ago
The reason macOS is so problem-free (relative to Linux) is that for practical purposes it "can't" be installed on all but a couple specific pieces of hardware. That's the trade-off I've chosen: MacOS is guaranteed to work well on my laptop because they were designed and built together, for each other. Put another way: the fact an apples-to-apples comparison to Linux is impossible is the reason macOS wins for me.
- rhn_mk1 5y ago
  I think you're ignoring the manufacturers of Linux laptops, like Purism or System76. Those are built together, for each other. Okay, maybe not as deeply as MacOS, but it's the only concern of those companies.
  - newsbinator 5y ago
    You might be right. I've never used a Purism or System76 laptop. If I can use it without ever having to know which boot loader I'm using (or what a boot loader is), what version of a given driver I have installed, which partition I'm writing to (or what a partition is), whether I'm currently logged in as root or as admin... ... that'd be comparable to MacOS, and it definitely opens the door to me switching to Linux if/when Apple takes a dark-enough turn. Now one might argue that every professional user, especially a programmer, should know what a boot loader is or what partition they should be writing to, since that's as basic a requirement to use a professional tool as touch-typing is. But I wouldn't agree with that; macOS abstracts away a lot of basic things, and that's why I like it.
    - rhn_mk1 5y ago
      You're not going to be disappointed when you give them a try then. They match your requirements so far. Sure, they have problems specific to them (e.g. losing encryption keys, some WiFi sticks unsupported by policy), but every ecosystem has rough edges you won't find elsewhere. BTW, there are more Linux-focused companies. Those two are just the ones I remember from the top of my head.
    - AnthonyMouse 5y ago
      > But I wouldn't agree with that; macOS abstracts away a lot of basic things, and that's why I like it. Everything does that now. People only care about boot loaders if they want to dual boot Windows, and in general the extent of caring about it is to confirm when the installer asks if that's what you want to do. Linux attracts the kinds of people who want to know what a boot loader is, because it makes that easier than alternatives do. But it's not actually required to use it.
  - kitsunesoba 5y ago
    My biggest gripe is how underwhelming Purism and system76 laptop hardware is relative to even Thinkpads and Framework, let alone MacBooks. I was strongly considering a system76 Lemur Pro early this year, but ultimately landed on a Thinkpad X1 Nano instead because of how much better of a screen the Nano is equipped with and its 16:10 screen ratio among other things.

neatze 5y ago

> And you also have to do neither on linux. what makes you say this ?

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
rhn_mk1 5y ago
Experience? If you buy a computer with Linux on it, you don't have to care.
pgcj_poster 5y ago
I've ran Linux on 6 different consumer laptops, and I've never had to configure a sound driver. I have had to choose a file system, but only on Arch and Debian, which are targeted toward advanced users.

newsbinator 5y ago

The reason macOS is so problem-free (relative to Linux) is that for practical purposes it "can't" be installed on all but a couple specific pieces of hardware. That's the trade-off I've chosen: MacOS is guaranteed to work well on my laptop because they were designed and built together, for each other. Put another way: the fact an apples-to-apples comparison to Linux is impossible is the reason macOS wins for me.

rhn_mk1 5y ago
I think you're ignoring the manufacturers of Linux laptops, like Purism or System76. Those are built together, for each other. Okay, maybe not as deeply as MacOS, but it's the only concern of those companies.
- newsbinator 5y ago
  You might be right. I've never used a Purism or System76 laptop. If I can use it without ever having to know which boot loader I'm using (or what a boot loader is), what version of a given driver I have installed, which partition I'm writing to (or what a partition is), whether I'm currently logged in as root or as admin... ... that'd be comparable to MacOS, and it definitely opens the door to me switching to Linux if/when Apple takes a dark-enough turn. Now one might argue that every professional user, especially a programmer, should know what a boot loader is or what partition they should be writing to, since that's as basic a requirement to use a professional tool as touch-typing is. But I wouldn't agree with that; macOS abstracts away a lot of basic things, and that's why I like it.
  - rhn_mk1 5y ago
    You're not going to be disappointed when you give them a try then. They match your requirements so far. Sure, they have problems specific to them (e.g. losing encryption keys, some WiFi sticks unsupported by policy), but every ecosystem has rough edges you won't find elsewhere. BTW, there are more Linux-focused companies. Those two are just the ones I remember from the top of my head.
  - AnthonyMouse 5y ago
    > But I wouldn't agree with that; macOS abstracts away a lot of basic things, and that's why I like it. Everything does that now. People only care about boot loaders if they want to dual boot Windows, and in general the extent of caring about it is to confirm when the installer asks if that's what you want to do. Linux attracts the kinds of people who want to know what a boot loader is, because it makes that easier than alternatives do. But it's not actually required to use it.
- kitsunesoba 5y ago
  My biggest gripe is how underwhelming Purism and system76 laptop hardware is relative to even Thinkpads and Framework, let alone MacBooks. I was strongly considering a system76 Lemur Pro early this year, but ultimately landed on a Thinkpad X1 Nano instead because of how much better of a screen the Nano is equipped with and its 16:10 screen ratio among other things.