3 ms·

It's a bit of an exaggeration to say "almost all" games at the highest level end in draws. I wouldn't have said that from my personal experience following top-l

by tehnub 5y ago

It's a bit of an exaggeration to say "almost all" games at the highest level end in draws. I wouldn't have said that from my personal experience following top-level chess, and the data indeed indicates it's under 75% [0]—which is a large proportion, but not "almost all". [0]: https://www.chess.com/article/view/the-draw-rule-is-classical-chess-dead https://www.chess.com/article/view/the-draw-rule-is-classica...

spoonjim 5y ago
At the very highest level, the draw percentage is much higher. In the last World Chess Championship in 2018, all twelve classical games went to draws! It's complete garbage from a spectator point of view.
- tehnub 5y ago
  Sure, but that's mainly because the WCC is such a high-stakes match. Their overall record is not so draw-dominated. According to [0], Classical games: Ian Nepomniachtchi beat Magnus Carlsen 4 to 2, with 14 draws. which gives a draw rate of 80%. [0]: https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl?page=1&player=carlsen&player2=ding&playercomp=either#:~:text=LIFETIME%20RECORD%3A,to%2019%2C%20with%2042%20draws https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl?page=1&player=carls....
- hibikir 5y ago
  It's not the level, but the WCC format, which makes current players not want to take risks at all. Today's game is a great example of why they are conservative: Taking any risks with black, like Nepo did when he avoided an early queen trade, is just too dangerous. A single loss means your opponent can aim for a draw in every single further game. If a super GM wants a draw out of the game from the very opening, choosing the most boring variations they can think of, someone is going to have to take crazy risks to stop it. Remember Kramnik's approach with the Berlin, turning the Ruy Lopez opening, known for its sharpness for centuries, into a recipe for draws. Look instead at the next highest level tournament, the WCC candidates. There's money on the line, but really, the chance for the title is so much more important, winning the tournament is all that matters, and you aren't getting there with just draws, or even just a couple of wins. The very top players in the world, other than the current WCC are the only ones that participate, and yet the draw rate is lower than that average 75% too: In the last tournament, Nepo lost 1 and won 5 out of 14 games. Same with Caruana in the 2018 candidates. That said, we'd see fewer draws too with shorter time controls, but then the top players also change. In 2018, if the championship was an infinite classic series until someone has 3 wins, Caruana was probably the favorite, given how he had Carlsen against the ropes over and over again, just a bit shy of victory. But in Rapid or Blitz, He's nowhere near as good.
  - spoonjim 5y ago
    Interesting, thanks for the clarification.

by tehnub 5y ago

spoonjim 5y ago

At the very highest level, the draw percentage is much higher. In the last World Chess Championship in 2018, all twelve classical games went to draws! It's complete garbage from a spectator point of view.

tehnub 5y ago
Sure, but that's mainly because the WCC is such a high-stakes match. Their overall record is not so draw-dominated. According to [0], Classical games: Ian Nepomniachtchi beat Magnus Carlsen 4 to 2, with 14 draws. which gives a draw rate of 80%. [0]: https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl?page=1&player=carlsen&player2=ding&playercomp=either#:~:text=LIFETIME%20RECORD%3A,to%2019%2C%20with%2042%20draws https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl?page=1&player=carls....
hibikir 5y ago
It's not the level, but the WCC format, which makes current players not want to take risks at all. Today's game is a great example of why they are conservative: Taking any risks with black, like Nepo did when he avoided an early queen trade, is just too dangerous. A single loss means your opponent can aim for a draw in every single further game. If a super GM wants a draw out of the game from the very opening, choosing the most boring variations they can think of, someone is going to have to take crazy risks to stop it. Remember Kramnik's approach with the Berlin, turning the Ruy Lopez opening, known for its sharpness for centuries, into a recipe for draws. Look instead at the next highest level tournament, the WCC candidates. There's money on the line, but really, the chance for the title is so much more important, winning the tournament is all that matters, and you aren't getting there with just draws, or even just a couple of wins. The very top players in the world, other than the current WCC are the only ones that participate, and yet the draw rate is lower than that average 75% too: In the last tournament, Nepo lost 1 and won 5 out of 14 games. Same with Caruana in the 2018 candidates. That said, we'd see fewer draws too with shorter time controls, but then the top players also change. In 2018, if the championship was an infinite classic series until someone has 3 wins, Caruana was probably the favorite, given how he had Carlsen against the ropes over and over again, just a bit shy of victory. But in Rapid or Blitz, He's nowhere near as good.
- spoonjim 5y ago
  Interesting, thanks for the clarification.