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> is an equally-capable blank slate. It seems like tabula rasa idealism has made a serious resurgence in leftist and liberal circles and the scary thing is tha

> is an equally-capable blank slate. It seems like tabula rasa idealism has made a serious resurgence in leftist and liberal circles and the scary thing is that nobody (other than extremists saying nonsense) is really talking about this explicitly. Somehow we went from a bunch of stuff being cultural constructs to literally everything is a cultural construct and then this somehow became extremely widespread in no time at all. We need to have this conversation out-loud.

ng12 5y ago
Careful there, Harrison Bergeron.
BitwiseFool 5y ago
Every single one of us has things we support in-public but don't sincerely support in-private. Most of the time this isn't a problem because the endorsements we make don't end up affecting our own personal lives. I have not met a single parent who didn't want to try and give their own children an advantage over the others. It is one thing to support "equity in education", but when parents sense that these activists are trying to dumb-down the curriculum, I expect significant pushback. Especially because this is quite literally a "won't somebody please think of the children" issue.
- csee 5y ago
  Why would there be pushback if they can just send their kids to private schools and not bear the negative consequences? Virtue signalling is actually advantageous to them. If they handicap all the public school kids then their own kids will be more likely to get into the top schools that manufacture scarcity.
  - BitwiseFool 5y ago
    I suspect plenty of parents will begin the process of trying to get their kinds into a private school, but it still requires a lot of resources and effort. I sense that most parents would try to fight this while simultaneously trying to find a way out while the process goes on. As for the competitive advantage, I think that only works for the children who are already in the private school system.
  - 908B64B197 5y ago
    It will also drop the average test score at public schools, thus getting the woke crowd to lower the standards again! The cycle repeats itself.
  - int_19h 5y ago
    Sending your kids to a private school is already considered suspect these days in some circles. And, conversely, some people specifically send their children to public schools for ideological reasons.
    - akomtu 5y ago
      Suspect in what sense?
      - int_19h 5y ago
        In a sense that it's considered classist and/or racist to do so.
  - VLM 5y ago
    Virtue signaling is always elitist. Look at whom does it. So the "social disease" of virtue signaling will follow the higher socioeconomic crowd where ever they go.
- bittercynic 5y ago
  This seems inconsistent on the surface, but I think it is reasonable to want both. You can push for a more equitable world while recognizing that we currently live in a society that's pretty economically savage to some of its members, and it's understandable to want yourself and loved ones to not be the ones on the losing end of our society.
cyber_kinetist 5y ago
> tabula rasa idealism has made a serious resurgence in leftist and liberal circles Maybe from liberals, but from what I've seen not the left. Marx's mantra is literally "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", it has nothing to do with liberal conceptions of tabula rasa idealism. I've never seen a leftist who asserts that people start from a blank state and can be "anyone" depending on the circumstances, that statement will get you accused of having bourgeois sensibilities who ignore the material forces of the world.
- guerrilla 5y ago
  Well, I can't say the same as that's the majority of where I see it from right now. I don't follow MLs on twitter but most of who I follow are anarchists and democratic socialists.
- rendang 5y ago
  Here is a noted leftist writer who is not necessarily arguing for the strongest case of "blank slatism" but is definitely pushing in that direction here, claiming that inherent differences are overemphasized. https://www.currentaffairs.org/2020/09/we-dont-know-our-potential https://www.currentaffairs.org/2020/09/we-dont-know-our-pote...
twblalock 5y ago
It's not just the assumption of a blank slate -- it's the assumption that because everyone is a blank slate, differences between people must be the result of oppression or racism of some kind, and that the primary purpose of education is not to teach, but rather to fight that oppression. Even mathematics education is now being twisted by this -- it's now seen as more important for math classes to pursue equality/equity than it is to teach math. One outcome of this is a levelling effect -- an equal outcome for all students, in which they all possess average mathematical skills, is preferred to a situation in which some students perform above average.
naasking 5y ago
> Somehow we went from a bunch of stuff being cultural constructs to literally everything is a cultural construct and then this somehow became extremely widespread in no time at all. The people who were critical of the first moves in this direction and explicitly said it would be a slippery slope were dismissed at the time. We're still moving in that direction. Hopefully the pendulum will swing back to something more reasonbale.

ng12 5y ago

Careful there, Harrison Bergeron.

BitwiseFool 5y ago

Every single one of us has things we support in-public but don't sincerely support in-private. Most of the time this isn't a problem because the endorsements we make don't end up affecting our own personal lives. I have not met a single parent who didn't want to try and give their own children an advantage over the others. It is one thing to support "equity in education", but when parents sense that these activists are trying to dumb-down the curriculum, I expect significant pushback. Especially because this is quite literally a "won't somebody please think of the children" issue.

csee 5y ago
Why would there be pushback if they can just send their kids to private schools and not bear the negative consequences? Virtue signalling is actually advantageous to them. If they handicap all the public school kids then their own kids will be more likely to get into the top schools that manufacture scarcity.
- BitwiseFool 5y ago
  I suspect plenty of parents will begin the process of trying to get their kinds into a private school, but it still requires a lot of resources and effort. I sense that most parents would try to fight this while simultaneously trying to find a way out while the process goes on. As for the competitive advantage, I think that only works for the children who are already in the private school system.
- 908B64B197 5y ago
  It will also drop the average test score at public schools, thus getting the woke crowd to lower the standards again! The cycle repeats itself.
- int_19h 5y ago
  Sending your kids to a private school is already considered suspect these days in some circles. And, conversely, some people specifically send their children to public schools for ideological reasons.
  - akomtu 5y ago
    Suspect in what sense?
    - int_19h 5y ago
      In a sense that it's considered classist and/or racist to do so.
- VLM 5y ago
  Virtue signaling is always elitist. Look at whom does it. So the "social disease" of virtue signaling will follow the higher socioeconomic crowd where ever they go.
bittercynic 5y ago
This seems inconsistent on the surface, but I think it is reasonable to want both. You can push for a more equitable world while recognizing that we currently live in a society that's pretty economically savage to some of its members, and it's understandable to want yourself and loved ones to not be the ones on the losing end of our society.

cyber_kinetist 5y ago

> tabula rasa idealism has made a serious resurgence in leftist and liberal circles Maybe from liberals, but from what I've seen not the left. Marx's mantra is literally "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs", it has nothing to do with liberal conceptions of tabula rasa idealism. I've never seen a leftist who asserts that people start from a blank state and can be "anyone" depending on the circumstances, that statement will get you accused of having bourgeois sensibilities who ignore the material forces of the world.

guerrilla 5y ago
Well, I can't say the same as that's the majority of where I see it from right now. I don't follow MLs on twitter but most of who I follow are anarchists and democratic socialists.
rendang 5y ago
Here is a noted leftist writer who is not necessarily arguing for the strongest case of "blank slatism" but is definitely pushing in that direction here, claiming that inherent differences are overemphasized. https://www.currentaffairs.org/2020/09/we-dont-know-our-potential https://www.currentaffairs.org/2020/09/we-dont-know-our-pote...

twblalock 5y ago

It's not just the assumption of a blank slate -- it's the assumption that because everyone is a blank slate, differences between people must be the result of oppression or racism of some kind, and that the primary purpose of education is not to teach, but rather to fight that oppression. Even mathematics education is now being twisted by this -- it's now seen as more important for math classes to pursue equality/equity than it is to teach math. One outcome of this is a levelling effect -- an equal outcome for all students, in which they all possess average mathematical skills, is preferred to a situation in which some students perform above average.

naasking 5y ago

> Somehow we went from a bunch of stuff being cultural constructs to literally everything is a cultural construct and then this somehow became extremely widespread in no time at all. The people who were critical of the first moves in this direction and explicitly said it would be a slippery slope were dismissed at the time. We're still moving in that direction. Hopefully the pendulum will swing back to something more reasonbale.