3 ms·

This is interesting, but not exactly news. Has been known for decades.

sliken 5y ago
Indeed, a major contributor is the AKC who rates breeds on arbitrary characteristics like shoulder height and color instead of overall fitness. So you end up with dogs with terrible hips, cancer, spine problems, breathing problems, etc but have the right color hair.
azemetre 5y ago
I do think it's news because some breeds suffer terribly at the end of their life, like golden retrieves typically getting cancer at 60% rates. [1] Would you get a golden retriever if you knew that at 7 years-old it's very likely to get a brain tumor? The same can be said for many breeds that suffer from breathing problems (pugs) or spinal issues (german shepherds) because someone decided that a german shepard should have a certain angle arc in its back because it was "visually" pleasing. It's honestly disgusting, the UK kennel club bares the majority of this suffering because they somehow declared themselves the defacto authority figure during the late 1880s. [1] https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-do-so-many-golden-retrievers-get-cancer-massive-study-hopes-to-find-out/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-do-so-many-golden-retriever...
- Frost1x 5y ago
  At some period of human history, breeding for some traits probably made sense, functionally. Dogs that could hunt well or track other animals for you all made sense in a survival situation. The mess we got into was when we started this whole selective genetic manipulation based on visual appearances and at the cost of their health. As pets, to me, it doesn't make a lot of sense to do all this nonsense selective breeding and inbreeding that perpetuates clear genetic issues that would resolve with a bit natural diversity. I never want to have a 'pure' bred dog both in principle against the idea and because more diversity means my pet has a better chance of moving away from bad generic traits or moving their pups into that direction (and a potentially longer, healthier life). My sibling owned a pug at one point when I was young and she was incredibly cute and sweet but at a cost to her health. Her facial wrinkle folds were prone to bacterial infection and had to be cleaned regularly, she suffered a lot of food allergies, had clear breathing problems, but fortunately didn't suffer from any sort of eye problems pugs are prone to. She ultimately died of cancer. I'll take rescue pets which are most often not selectively bred any day over encouraging the breeding nonsense. All of my rescue pets have lived long and healthy lives into old age with almost no issues, just by avoiding inbreeding for at least one level of lineage.
- bsder 5y ago
  > Would you get a golden retriever if you knew that at 7 years-old it's very likely to get a brain tumor? Dogs have a lifespan. It's shorter than ours. It's sad, but it simply is. Scottish terriers seem to get cancers around 10-12 years. My dog died at 11 of liver cancer. A brother died of a stomach cancer similarly. The mother died of a brain cancer at about the same age. Was the joy and happiness brought by those dogs not worth it simply because their lifespan wasn't longer?
  - azemetre 5y ago
    The joy and happiness is purely at the expense of unethical practices tho, that is my issue. These are living empathetic creatures, not designer fashion pieces (which is often what pure breeds are selected to emulate). There's no reason why you couldn't bread a healthy retriever dog, yes it may not look exactly like the current iteration of a golden retriever but it will live a life that is less likely to be purposely afflicted with pain or suffering. I've only owned mixed dogs and they've all lived extremely health lives with zero joint, spine, breathing, or jaw issues.

Indeed, a major contributor is the AKC who rates breeds on arbitrary characteristics like shoulder height and color instead of overall fitness. So you end up with dogs with terrible hips, cancer, spine problems, breathing problems, etc but have the right color hair.

azemetre 5y ago

I do think it's news because some breeds suffer terribly at the end of their life, like golden retrieves typically getting cancer at 60% rates. [1] Would you get a golden retriever if you knew that at 7 years-old it's very likely to get a brain tumor? The same can be said for many breeds that suffer from breathing problems (pugs) or spinal issues (german shepherds) because someone decided that a german shepard should have a certain angle arc in its back because it was "visually" pleasing. It's honestly disgusting, the UK kennel club bares the majority of this suffering because they somehow declared themselves the defacto authority figure during the late 1880s. [1] https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-do-so-many-golden-retrievers-get-cancer-massive-study-hopes-to-find-out/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-do-so-many-golden-retriever...

Frost1x 5y ago
At some period of human history, breeding for some traits probably made sense, functionally. Dogs that could hunt well or track other animals for you all made sense in a survival situation. The mess we got into was when we started this whole selective genetic manipulation based on visual appearances and at the cost of their health. As pets, to me, it doesn't make a lot of sense to do all this nonsense selective breeding and inbreeding that perpetuates clear genetic issues that would resolve with a bit natural diversity. I never want to have a 'pure' bred dog both in principle against the idea and because more diversity means my pet has a better chance of moving away from bad generic traits or moving their pups into that direction (and a potentially longer, healthier life). My sibling owned a pug at one point when I was young and she was incredibly cute and sweet but at a cost to her health. Her facial wrinkle folds were prone to bacterial infection and had to be cleaned regularly, she suffered a lot of food allergies, had clear breathing problems, but fortunately didn't suffer from any sort of eye problems pugs are prone to. She ultimately died of cancer. I'll take rescue pets which are most often not selectively bred any day over encouraging the breeding nonsense. All of my rescue pets have lived long and healthy lives into old age with almost no issues, just by avoiding inbreeding for at least one level of lineage.
bsder 5y ago
> Would you get a golden retriever if you knew that at 7 years-old it's very likely to get a brain tumor? Dogs have a lifespan. It's shorter than ours. It's sad, but it simply is. Scottish terriers seem to get cancers around 10-12 years. My dog died at 11 of liver cancer. A brother died of a stomach cancer similarly. The mother died of a brain cancer at about the same age. Was the joy and happiness brought by those dogs not worth it simply because their lifespan wasn't longer?
- azemetre 5y ago
  The joy and happiness is purely at the expense of unethical practices tho, that is my issue. These are living empathetic creatures, not designer fashion pieces (which is often what pure breeds are selected to emulate). There's no reason why you couldn't bread a healthy retriever dog, yes it may not look exactly like the current iteration of a golden retriever but it will live a life that is less likely to be purposely afflicted with pain or suffering. I've only owned mixed dogs and they've all lived extremely health lives with zero joint, spine, breathing, or jaw issues.