6 ms·

> I don't want that in my car You are free not to buy. > I don't want my car thinking because it can't see the fucking lines on the road If you drive outside

> I don't want that in my car You are free not to buy. > I don't want my car thinking because it can't see the fucking lines on the road If you drive outside of "safe drive envelope" it does not matter if you're drunk or road conditions are dangerous. Safety systems should prevent accident in both cases.

mdp2021 5y ago
> You are free not to buy There do already exist pieces of legislation that cripple the acceptability not of one vehicle, but whole categories of vehicles (and practically potentially all of them). One such is the "E-call" in Europe.
ehnto 5y ago
The expanse of road environments where it's totally reasonable and safe to drive with which there are no lines is pretty large. Driving an unsealed country road could look to the cars metrics like I am driving drunk for example. The "you are free to not buy" argument is not valid if it's a regulation for all new cars. Eventually all viable road legal car stock will contain the regulated device.
- helge9210 5y ago
  > could look to the cars metrics like I am driving drunk Same as sudden acceleration or breaking. Don't buy car like this.
  - eliasmacpherson 5y ago
    It's the same problem as the 737MAX MCAS, features shoehorned in, probably with bugs, poorly advertised, lack of training, misfeatures sold as default, leading to fatal pilot/driver confusion. My elderly parent has bought a car with some of these features second hand, it will be great fun figuring out what is working as designed when a heavy vehicle has lost control and is lurching towards us at high speed. https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/vulnerable-road-user-auto-emergency-braking https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/vulnerable-r... https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/driver-attention-detection https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/driver-atten... https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/lane-keep-assist https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/lane-keep-as...
  - _0ffh 5y ago
    > Don't buy car like this So how exactly would that work, given that there will be no options?
    - helge9210 5y ago
      Don't use car at all, for example.
      - _0ffh 5y ago
        For some people that is not an option.
        Steltek 5y ago
        That is the root cause of why this is being introduced and why there's a fight. As a society, the US absolutely refuses to prioritize safe driving over access to driving. We accept road deaths as the cost of business for our suburban sprawl and car-only infrastructure. Cars are the only option because so many places don't even have sidewalks, forget buses and bike lanes. Hell, in red states, you'll be terrorized by drivers simply for being on a bicycle.
        helge9210 5y ago
        You can pay someone, who has no objections to implemented safety measures, to provide you with transportation services.
        ehnto 5y ago
        You are being unempathetic and dismissive to the issues it raises, that is not a solution to the problem raised, nor is "Just don't drive". This isn't about the specific safety measure in question, the issue is invasive technology mandates in personal vehicles potentially excluding people from driving due to a desire to not be tracked by technology companies and government services. Imagine if they mandated the same thing on your smartphone. The answer could be "Don't use a smartphone", but that's obviously not an inclusive option. "Be tracked or exclude yourself from the modern world" is simply not a fair way to approach issues like this. Consider as well that the US has built a society heavily based around personal car usage, towns and cities are built around it, jobs and education expect it of you. So you are born into a car-first society, but then given the ultimatum of tracking and monitoring or reduced freedom of movement.
hibbelig 5y ago
> You are free not to buy. Hardly. It's a mandate for the car manufacturers.

mdp2021 5y ago

> You are free not to buy There do already exist pieces of legislation that cripple the acceptability not of one vehicle, but whole categories of vehicles (and practically potentially all of them). One such is the "E-call" in Europe.

ehnto 5y ago

The expanse of road environments where it's totally reasonable and safe to drive with which there are no lines is pretty large. Driving an unsealed country road could look to the cars metrics like I am driving drunk for example. The "you are free to not buy" argument is not valid if it's a regulation for all new cars. Eventually all viable road legal car stock will contain the regulated device.

helge9210 5y ago
> could look to the cars metrics like I am driving drunk Same as sudden acceleration or breaking. Don't buy car like this.
- eliasmacpherson 5y ago
  It's the same problem as the 737MAX MCAS, features shoehorned in, probably with bugs, poorly advertised, lack of training, misfeatures sold as default, leading to fatal pilot/driver confusion. My elderly parent has bought a car with some of these features second hand, it will be great fun figuring out what is working as designed when a heavy vehicle has lost control and is lurching towards us at high speed. https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/vulnerable-road-user-auto-emergency-braking https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/vulnerable-r... https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/driver-attention-detection https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/driver-atten... https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/lane-keep-assist https://howsafeisyourcar.com.au/safety-features/lane-keep-as...
- _0ffh 5y ago
  > Don't buy car like this So how exactly would that work, given that there will be no options?
  - helge9210 5y ago
    Don't use car at all, for example.
    - _0ffh 5y ago
      For some people that is not an option.
      - Steltek 5y ago
        That is the root cause of why this is being introduced and why there's a fight. As a society, the US absolutely refuses to prioritize safe driving over access to driving. We accept road deaths as the cost of business for our suburban sprawl and car-only infrastructure. Cars are the only option because so many places don't even have sidewalks, forget buses and bike lanes. Hell, in red states, you'll be terrorized by drivers simply for being on a bicycle.
      - helge9210 5y ago
        You can pay someone, who has no objections to implemented safety measures, to provide you with transportation services.
        ehnto 5y ago
        You are being unempathetic and dismissive to the issues it raises, that is not a solution to the problem raised, nor is "Just don't drive". This isn't about the specific safety measure in question, the issue is invasive technology mandates in personal vehicles potentially excluding people from driving due to a desire to not be tracked by technology companies and government services. Imagine if they mandated the same thing on your smartphone. The answer could be "Don't use a smartphone", but that's obviously not an inclusive option. "Be tracked or exclude yourself from the modern world" is simply not a fair way to approach issues like this. Consider as well that the US has built a society heavily based around personal car usage, towns and cities are built around it, jobs and education expect it of you. So you are born into a car-first society, but then given the ultimatum of tracking and monitoring or reduced freedom of movement.

hibbelig 5y ago

> You are free not to buy. Hardly. It's a mandate for the car manufacturers.