4 ms·

You seem absolutely certain you are right about certain issues. One of the big draws of America originally was that is was huge and open and you could join a co

by Veelox 5y ago

You seem absolutely certain you are right about certain issues. One of the big draws of America originally was that is was huge and open and you could join a community that agreed with what you mostly. Yes some people view abortion as a right, others view it as murder. The process shouldn't be to gain enough power to force everyone to follow what you want. It should be to establish rules we can all live by and then live and let live. Mississippi wants strong restrictions after 15 weeks. Let them. New York wants on demand until birth. Let them. Honestly, if I know your opinion on abortion I shouldn't be able to guess your opinion on taxes. It would be good to allow more diversity in options and long term we can see which ones work.

thurn 5y ago
I assume you'd also have felt this way about e.g. segregation? An equally controversial issue in its time?
- Veelox 5y ago
  "All men are created equal" is a pretty compelling reason to end segregation. "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" is a pretty compelling reason to end gun control. "nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law" is a pretty compelling reason to require a trial to have an abortion. You can make really good arguments from our established principles for and against most controversial issues. There is a clear method to add rights to the Constitution. I would say that happened for segregation and it took awhile to be enacted. If someone wants to change something for abortion or gun control let's amend the founding document otherwise let people live within the rules we have set.
ModernMech 5y ago
IMO the actual big draw of America was that it was a nation of laws and ideals, rather than a nation of men. Those ideals are that there exists a fundamental right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness for every person. The problem with the idea that we can all join a community that agreed mostly with ourselves, is that some people mostly agree that some humans can be considered property based on the color of their skin. Or that women should be subservient to men. Or that the final solution to their problems is that one religion or ethnicity should be excluded from their society. These people exist today, they were not defeated in the Civil War or WWII. See: Charlottesville. The process isn’t about forcing everyone to follow what you want. It’s to force everyone to permit everyone else the fundamental rights protected by the Constituiton. We know for a fact that when you let people organize into autonomous groups based on their own preferences, some will tend to organize into a group that is at stark odds with the idea and ideals of America. We’ve seen it before with disastrous consequences.

by Veelox 5y ago

thurn 5y ago

I assume you'd also have felt this way about e.g. segregation? An equally controversial issue in its time?

Veelox 5y ago
"All men are created equal" is a pretty compelling reason to end segregation. "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" is a pretty compelling reason to end gun control. "nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law" is a pretty compelling reason to require a trial to have an abortion. You can make really good arguments from our established principles for and against most controversial issues. There is a clear method to add rights to the Constitution. I would say that happened for segregation and it took awhile to be enacted. If someone wants to change something for abortion or gun control let's amend the founding document otherwise let people live within the rules we have set.

ModernMech 5y ago

IMO the actual big draw of America was that it was a nation of laws and ideals, rather than a nation of men. Those ideals are that there exists a fundamental right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness for every person. The problem with the idea that we can all join a community that agreed mostly with ourselves, is that some people mostly agree that some humans can be considered property based on the color of their skin. Or that women should be subservient to men. Or that the final solution to their problems is that one religion or ethnicity should be excluded from their society. These people exist today, they were not defeated in the Civil War or WWII. See: Charlottesville. The process isn’t about forcing everyone to follow what you want. It’s to force everyone to permit everyone else the fundamental rights protected by the Constituiton. We know for a fact that when you let people organize into autonomous groups based on their own preferences, some will tend to organize into a group that is at stark odds with the idea and ideals of America. We’ve seen it before with disastrous consequences.