5 ms·

The first step in solving a problem is realizing there actually is a problem. If you think about it, humanity really is getting better and better over time. Tha

The first step in solving a problem is realizing there actually is a problem. If you think about it, humanity really is getting better and better over time. That thought really doesn't help much when you are fighting with a big bank about $261 in random fees, though.

Clubber 5y ago
>If you think about it, humanity really is getting better and better over time. That is such a vague statement it is essentially meaningless. Better how? How is it not better? What do you mean by humanity? How is your life better? How is it worse?
- nomdep 5y ago
  On average, middle class and below lives longer and more confortable than in the previous thousands of years.
  - Clubber 5y ago
    When you go back thousands of years, it's pretty easy assertion to make. How about the last 40? Are we really better off in totality or just different? I can think of some things that are better, but I can think of a bunch of things that are much worse.
    - kijin 5y ago
      Why focus on the last 40 years as opposed to the last 4, 400 or 40000 years? Anyone can pick two convenient points on the timeline and argue that things got worse over that period, but larger trends are harder to overlook. Stock prices have fallen a bit this week compared to last week, and some stocks are doing worse than others. It doesn't mean the market generally hasn't been rallying for the last decade or so.
    - danans 5y ago
      > How about the last 40? Are we really better off in totality or just different? IMO in the last 40 years it has become harder (more expensive) for those who have had it a bit better off to separate themselves both physically and culturally from those who are a lot worse off (regardless of why they are worse off). All the while the cost and accessibility of erstwhile public goods that temper that desire for that separation, like safety and education, have skyrocketed. That separation and the inequality behind it has doubtlessly been enabled by a heap of injustices. The effects of this are seen in situations spanning from police brutality to current refugee migration crises. We haven't been able to as effectively outsource pain and chaos to others (whether in our own backyard or the other side of the planet) while shielding ourselves from the blowback like we once did. Therefore people feel worse off, not because they are necessarily worse off, but because they fear that the nearing chaos will make them permanently worse off. The richest <1% don't have to directly deal this problem, since they can easily still pay for that separation.
  - lm28469 5y ago
    Length of life and comfort don't mean much once you reached the bare minimum. If you have running water, central heating, a mattress and own any kind of motorised vehicle you live a more comfortable life than any medieval king. So yeah, sure, we have netflix, smart bulbs and food delivery. Can you sustain a family as easily as your grandparents ? Will you retire as early as them ? Will you acquire an house as easily and as early ? How meaningful is your job ? The endgame of "length and comfort" is to live in some kind of coma pod like in The Matrix, you'd probably live to 150 years in absolute comfort https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Moral_letters_to_Lucilius/Letter_93 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Moral_letters_to_Lucilius/Let...
    - Clubber 5y ago
      There's an old bluegrass song called "I'll Fly Away," the music is very happy and upbeat. When you listen to the lyrics, you realize it's a slave song about how the narrator is looking forward to death so they can escape the horrible life they are living. The point of that is just because we live longer doesn't mean we live better.
      - all2 5y ago
        For more on the song: http://www.trialanderrorcollective.com/collective-collab-blogs--playlists/ill-fly-away-a-brief-history-of-the-quintessential-gospel-song-and-ten-great-renditions http://www.trialanderrorcollective.com/collective-collab-blo...
      - germinalphrase 5y ago
        Relevant African American Folktale: “The People Could Fly” https://www.wheelcouncil.org/stories/the-people-could-fly/ https://www.wheelcouncil.org/stories/the-people-could-fly/
      - NateEag 5y ago
        A few point out that 1) A ton of bluegrass sets grim, sad lyrics to bouncy major music - it's pretty much how the genre works 2) I'll Fly Away is a Christian song, so it's not exactly "looking forward to death" so much as "looking forward to heaven and communion with God". Granted, those two things are closely linked in the religion.
- lm28469 5y ago
  When people say that on HN I read it as: "as a young, healthy and well paid tech worker living in _tech hub of a western country_ life is really good and getting better". We have it really easy indeed, but you can't project that on "humanity"
  - colinmhayes 5y ago
    Global poverty has never been lower, things are not just improving for white collar workers.
    - krmboya 5y ago
      What counts as global poverty in the course of human history?
- cowl 5y ago
  By every measurable metric, Humanity has gotten better. Longer lifespan, lower child mortality, better education, easier access to basic life neccessities and goods, (ironic to say at this time but yes even) better health, etc etc etc. We live in an age where every problem is weaponised and we are hyperaware of the problems now so that we don't see all the progrees that is done. https://www.openculture.com/2020/05/16-ways-the-world-is-getting-remarkably-better.html https://www.openculture.com/2020/05/16-ways-the-world-is-get... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVimVzgtD6w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVimVzgtD6w
  - Clubber 5y ago
    >By every measurable metric Every measurable metric? How about median wealth? How about levels of debt? How about job satisfaction? How about median income per household? Per person? How about access to healthcare and cost? How about suicide rates? How about drug overdose rates? How about corruption? How about cost of higher education? How about homelessness? I mean cmon, you're looking at thing with rose colored glasses.
    - pietrovismara 5y ago
      Life today is so much better than at any other time in history, because washing machines! And because I'm middle upper class, almost forgot that.
    - all2 5y ago
      As long as we're "howaboutin" let's talk about genetic diversity. DNA is self-replicating, self-repairing, etc. But what it doesn't do is create new information. With human procreation methodologies we lose bits of data, and just living life our data undergoes entropy. The outcome is less genetic information available every generation. And one more "how about testosterone levels in men?" These have been falling for the last 60 or 70 years. Men in the West will be impotent by 2040ish at current rates of decline.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - 5y ago
- chubot 5y ago
  Good list: https://www.gwern.net/Improvements https://www.gwern.net/Improvements I feel food is immeasurably better than in the 1990's when I grew up. I'd partially attribute that to faster and better communication -- i.e. if you take the Internet away from a chef or farmer, I think their universe of ideas and ingredients would be dramatically smaller. Speakers you can get for just $500 have made a big jump since even 2015 (though this is a tiny niche; in general audio quality is worse than in the 1970's.) Combat sports are also having a renaissance and many people attribute that to YouTube! That said, I totally agree with this article, and with the premise. There is rising economic inequality, and regulation has a place in imposing values on the market. Markets where nobody trusts each other aren't efficient or useful. I think the area where that really hits home and is made tangible is architecture. If you just let the market run wild with architecture, you're going to get really ugly boxy buildings that make everyone miserable. We live in a shared space, so you need cooperation to make good architecture. Unfortunately it does seem like that's been on the decline. Architecture is worse than it was in the past. Related: https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2021/10/why-are-newer-nice-neighborhoods-so-hard-to-find.html https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2021/10/wh... I'd also agree that computing is worse than it was 20 years ago in many important ways. I wouldn't say it's worse overall, e.g. being able to handle video is a big improvement. Wireless is pretty good although there are many flaky incarnations of it. But I'd say both user interfaces and latency are worse, products are more user hostile, and the web is filled with ads and low quality information. Hardware is now proprietary software, so a Linux system is less open than it used to be.

Clubber 5y ago

>If you think about it, humanity really is getting better and better over time. That is such a vague statement it is essentially meaningless. Better how? How is it not better? What do you mean by humanity? How is your life better? How is it worse?

nomdep 5y ago
On average, middle class and below lives longer and more confortable than in the previous thousands of years.
- Clubber 5y ago
  When you go back thousands of years, it's pretty easy assertion to make. How about the last 40? Are we really better off in totality or just different? I can think of some things that are better, but I can think of a bunch of things that are much worse.
  - kijin 5y ago
    Why focus on the last 40 years as opposed to the last 4, 400 or 40000 years? Anyone can pick two convenient points on the timeline and argue that things got worse over that period, but larger trends are harder to overlook. Stock prices have fallen a bit this week compared to last week, and some stocks are doing worse than others. It doesn't mean the market generally hasn't been rallying for the last decade or so.
  - danans 5y ago
    > How about the last 40? Are we really better off in totality or just different? IMO in the last 40 years it has become harder (more expensive) for those who have had it a bit better off to separate themselves both physically and culturally from those who are a lot worse off (regardless of why they are worse off). All the while the cost and accessibility of erstwhile public goods that temper that desire for that separation, like safety and education, have skyrocketed. That separation and the inequality behind it has doubtlessly been enabled by a heap of injustices. The effects of this are seen in situations spanning from police brutality to current refugee migration crises. We haven't been able to as effectively outsource pain and chaos to others (whether in our own backyard or the other side of the planet) while shielding ourselves from the blowback like we once did. Therefore people feel worse off, not because they are necessarily worse off, but because they fear that the nearing chaos will make them permanently worse off. The richest <1% don't have to directly deal this problem, since they can easily still pay for that separation.
- lm28469 5y ago
  Length of life and comfort don't mean much once you reached the bare minimum. If you have running water, central heating, a mattress and own any kind of motorised vehicle you live a more comfortable life than any medieval king. So yeah, sure, we have netflix, smart bulbs and food delivery. Can you sustain a family as easily as your grandparents ? Will you retire as early as them ? Will you acquire an house as easily and as early ? How meaningful is your job ? The endgame of "length and comfort" is to live in some kind of coma pod like in The Matrix, you'd probably live to 150 years in absolute comfort https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Moral_letters_to_Lucilius/Letter_93 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Moral_letters_to_Lucilius/Let...
  - Clubber 5y ago
    There's an old bluegrass song called "I'll Fly Away," the music is very happy and upbeat. When you listen to the lyrics, you realize it's a slave song about how the narrator is looking forward to death so they can escape the horrible life they are living. The point of that is just because we live longer doesn't mean we live better.
    - all2 5y ago
      For more on the song: http://www.trialanderrorcollective.com/collective-collab-blogs--playlists/ill-fly-away-a-brief-history-of-the-quintessential-gospel-song-and-ten-great-renditions http://www.trialanderrorcollective.com/collective-collab-blo...
    - germinalphrase 5y ago
      Relevant African American Folktale: “The People Could Fly” https://www.wheelcouncil.org/stories/the-people-could-fly/ https://www.wheelcouncil.org/stories/the-people-could-fly/
    - NateEag 5y ago
      A few point out that 1) A ton of bluegrass sets grim, sad lyrics to bouncy major music - it's pretty much how the genre works 2) I'll Fly Away is a Christian song, so it's not exactly "looking forward to death" so much as "looking forward to heaven and communion with God". Granted, those two things are closely linked in the religion.
lm28469 5y ago
When people say that on HN I read it as: "as a young, healthy and well paid tech worker living in _tech hub of a western country_ life is really good and getting better". We have it really easy indeed, but you can't project that on "humanity"
- colinmhayes 5y ago
  Global poverty has never been lower, things are not just improving for white collar workers.
  - krmboya 5y ago
    What counts as global poverty in the course of human history?
cowl 5y ago
By every measurable metric, Humanity has gotten better. Longer lifespan, lower child mortality, better education, easier access to basic life neccessities and goods, (ironic to say at this time but yes even) better health, etc etc etc. We live in an age where every problem is weaponised and we are hyperaware of the problems now so that we don't see all the progrees that is done. https://www.openculture.com/2020/05/16-ways-the-world-is-getting-remarkably-better.html https://www.openculture.com/2020/05/16-ways-the-world-is-get... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVimVzgtD6w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVimVzgtD6w
- Clubber 5y ago
  >By every measurable metric Every measurable metric? How about median wealth? How about levels of debt? How about job satisfaction? How about median income per household? Per person? How about access to healthcare and cost? How about suicide rates? How about drug overdose rates? How about corruption? How about cost of higher education? How about homelessness? I mean cmon, you're looking at thing with rose colored glasses.
  - pietrovismara 5y ago
    Life today is so much better than at any other time in history, because washing machines! And because I'm middle upper class, almost forgot that.
  - all2 5y ago
    As long as we're "howaboutin" let's talk about genetic diversity. DNA is self-replicating, self-repairing, etc. But what it doesn't do is create new information. With human procreation methodologies we lose bits of data, and just living life our data undergoes entropy. The outcome is less genetic information available every generation. And one more "how about testosterone levels in men?" These have been falling for the last 60 or 70 years. Men in the West will be impotent by 2040ish at current rates of decline.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - 5y ago
chubot 5y ago
Good list: https://www.gwern.net/Improvements https://www.gwern.net/Improvements I feel food is immeasurably better than in the 1990's when I grew up. I'd partially attribute that to faster and better communication -- i.e. if you take the Internet away from a chef or farmer, I think their universe of ideas and ingredients would be dramatically smaller. Speakers you can get for just $500 have made a big jump since even 2015 (though this is a tiny niche; in general audio quality is worse than in the 1970's.) Combat sports are also having a renaissance and many people attribute that to YouTube! That said, I totally agree with this article, and with the premise. There is rising economic inequality, and regulation has a place in imposing values on the market. Markets where nobody trusts each other aren't efficient or useful. I think the area where that really hits home and is made tangible is architecture. If you just let the market run wild with architecture, you're going to get really ugly boxy buildings that make everyone miserable. We live in a shared space, so you need cooperation to make good architecture. Unfortunately it does seem like that's been on the decline. Architecture is worse than it was in the past. Related: https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2021/10/why-are-newer-nice-neighborhoods-so-hard-to-find.html https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2021/10/wh... I'd also agree that computing is worse than it was 20 years ago in many important ways. I wouldn't say it's worse overall, e.g. being able to handle video is a big improvement. Wireless is pretty good although there are many flaky incarnations of it. But I'd say both user interfaces and latency are worse, products are more user hostile, and the web is filled with ads and low quality information. Hardware is now proprietary software, so a Linux system is less open than it used to be.