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Once again cryptocurrency shills are disproven in their core belief that they can do finance better than status quo.

by knorker 5y ago

corndoge 5y ago
Can you elaborate on how this event constitutes proof of your claim?
- brootstrap 5y ago
  i'm not worried about my DIS shares getting hacked as they chill in the digital world compounding interest. It appears that investing in crypto is not quite as safe? One of my bros got hacked in mt gox and since then i've been a bit weary of putting serious sums of money into it (i have maybe 1-5% of my portfolio in crypto and not planning on betting the house anytime soon).
  - corndoge 5y ago
    It's certainly not as safe. And one hack doesn't constitute "proof" that the entire space is a total fail at beating traditional finance, which should be obvious. Instead we have people like OP making sensational claims about "shills", providing nothing of value to any conversation about the topic.
    - knorker 5y ago
      It's not one. It's like one per week. And every smart contract is a self-funded hack bounty. Smart contracts are a complete misunderstanding of what contracts are, and what the hard parts of the space of contracts are. They're simply changing the simple problem to be enormously complex, without making the hard problems any easier. In fact it makes the hard problems harder too. causing great public interest and excitement. > OP making sensational claims Def 1. "causing great public interest and excitement" Well, not really. This story is just "huh, another one". Brings to mind the meme "I'm shocked, shocked!, to see another one of the cryptocurrency LARPers topple over" Def 2. "very good indeed; very impressive or attractive." Thank you!
- knorker 5y ago
  One of the core pillars of cryptocurrency, and DeFi, is that traditional finance is anachronistic, and full of stupid stuff not fit for the modern age. Take the first sentence on ethereum's intro to DeFi: "DeFi is an open and global financial system built for the internet age – an alternative to a system that's opaque, tightly controlled, and held together by decades-old infrastructure and processes. " Lots of the slowness and beurocracy of old finance is scoffed at as being, in more words, "stupid bullshit". Rule after rule, and obstacle after obstacle, is loudly ranted about how terrible it is. So the solution, in these people's explicit methods, is to throw away everything and start green field. Now, I'm a software engineer. I understand the allure of green field. Surely, "how hard could it be"? So because the description of how stupid cryptocurrency is can fill books (and there are several), let's stick to a short summary of the outcome of DeFi so far: It's barely newsworthy every time one of these LARP banks topple over, losing all the money. It's almost a weekly occurance. And not only is all the money stolen, it's also not reversible! When one of the founders of the pirate bay hacked a (real) bank's mainframe, he didn't actually get away with much (a couple of hundred dollars, I think was all that his accomplices managed to withdraw from ATMs). The rest was transferred back. (also suddenly "lack of extradition treaty" became a non-problem) Basically cryptocurrencies and DeFi is software engineers with no understanding of economics, law, or society, discovering why all of the rules, laws, and procedures currently in place exist. Another example is that AML/KYC laws didn't fall from the sky. "Well what if we didn't have laws at all?" is not really a rational place to start. That's not to say that traditional finance is perfect. Absolutely not. But the cure for bad laws is not "The Purge". So yeah, it's not this event, so much as this happens all the fucking time. Imagine if these people were selling cars, and complaining about how much pushback they're getting for putting them on public roads, while every day there's deaths all over from unregulated cars that have swords on them, chopping heads off of the drivers themselves, and innocent pedestrians. Like, how do you not see why this is causing pushback and that your way of replacing the seatbelt with a potato is stupid, and that actually the law that says a seatbelt is not allowed to be a potato maybe has a valid point? Especially since things are more subtle than that. A non-techie cannot tell the difference between a seatbelt and a potato, and that's why the law says your car needs to have actual seatbelts.
  - malermeister 5y ago
trutannus 5y ago
Its starting to look like the benefits of decentralized banks lean more in favor of the bank robbers than the bank clients.
- knorker 5y ago
  Luckily none of the bank clients actually have any intention of moving their banking into DeFi. They just move some speculation and crime there. Among the clients nobody innocent gets hurt, as there is nobody innocent. Now ransomware and such...
  - trutannus 5y ago
    Not sure I agree. I'm sure there's plenty of innocents who've been forcefully convinced by some crypto zelot, or FOMOed their way into the crypto world. In terms of normal bank clients moving to a DAO bank or something silly like that, you're right, nobody in their right minds is doing this.
    - knorker 5y ago
      Maybe. Depends how "innocent" someone is when they are blinded by greed, even if greed fueled by scammers. Would that same person be culpable if they did as little due diligance before "investing" in more traditional organized crime, lured in by "you can't lose. It's a sure bet, 10x gains!"? At best the innocents here "invested" in a lottery ticket, and lost in the same way that a non-winning lottery ticket loses.
      - trutannus 5y ago
        Not everything is this black and white. Some people are not motivated by greed as much as misplaced fear that's been stirred up by the crypto folks. Open any crypto discussion and see how many clicks it takes to get to someone panicking over hyperinflation, bank failures, invoking the ghost of 2008, ect. For all their talk of FUD, crypto folks dish the FUD out onto the traditional banking system almost as hard as the traditional banking system dishes it out on crypto. Mix that with someone who's easily impressionable and anxious, and you get someone who'll likely make some very bad decisions.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

Once again cryptocurrency shills are disproven in their core belief that they can do finance better than status quo.

corndoge 5y ago

Can you elaborate on how this event constitutes proof of your claim?

brootstrap 5y ago
i'm not worried about my DIS shares getting hacked as they chill in the digital world compounding interest. It appears that investing in crypto is not quite as safe? One of my bros got hacked in mt gox and since then i've been a bit weary of putting serious sums of money into it (i have maybe 1-5% of my portfolio in crypto and not planning on betting the house anytime soon).
- corndoge 5y ago
  It's certainly not as safe. And one hack doesn't constitute "proof" that the entire space is a total fail at beating traditional finance, which should be obvious. Instead we have people like OP making sensational claims about "shills", providing nothing of value to any conversation about the topic.
  - knorker 5y ago
    It's not one. It's like one per week. And every smart contract is a self-funded hack bounty. Smart contracts are a complete misunderstanding of what contracts are, and what the hard parts of the space of contracts are. They're simply changing the simple problem to be enormously complex, without making the hard problems any easier. In fact it makes the hard problems harder too. causing great public interest and excitement. > OP making sensational claims Def 1. "causing great public interest and excitement" Well, not really. This story is just "huh, another one". Brings to mind the meme "I'm shocked, shocked!, to see another one of the cryptocurrency LARPers topple over" Def 2. "very good indeed; very impressive or attractive." Thank you!
knorker 5y ago
One of the core pillars of cryptocurrency, and DeFi, is that traditional finance is anachronistic, and full of stupid stuff not fit for the modern age. Take the first sentence on ethereum's intro to DeFi: "DeFi is an open and global financial system built for the internet age – an alternative to a system that's opaque, tightly controlled, and held together by decades-old infrastructure and processes. " Lots of the slowness and beurocracy of old finance is scoffed at as being, in more words, "stupid bullshit". Rule after rule, and obstacle after obstacle, is loudly ranted about how terrible it is. So the solution, in these people's explicit methods, is to throw away everything and start green field. Now, I'm a software engineer. I understand the allure of green field. Surely, "how hard could it be"? So because the description of how stupid cryptocurrency is can fill books (and there are several), let's stick to a short summary of the outcome of DeFi so far: It's barely newsworthy every time one of these LARP banks topple over, losing all the money. It's almost a weekly occurance. And not only is all the money stolen, it's also not reversible! When one of the founders of the pirate bay hacked a (real) bank's mainframe, he didn't actually get away with much (a couple of hundred dollars, I think was all that his accomplices managed to withdraw from ATMs). The rest was transferred back. (also suddenly "lack of extradition treaty" became a non-problem) Basically cryptocurrencies and DeFi is software engineers with no understanding of economics, law, or society, discovering why all of the rules, laws, and procedures currently in place exist. Another example is that AML/KYC laws didn't fall from the sky. "Well what if we didn't have laws at all?" is not really a rational place to start. That's not to say that traditional finance is perfect. Absolutely not. But the cure for bad laws is not "The Purge". So yeah, it's not this event, so much as this happens all the fucking time. Imagine if these people were selling cars, and complaining about how much pushback they're getting for putting them on public roads, while every day there's deaths all over from unregulated cars that have swords on them, chopping heads off of the drivers themselves, and innocent pedestrians. Like, how do you not see why this is causing pushback and that your way of replacing the seatbelt with a potato is stupid, and that actually the law that says a seatbelt is not allowed to be a potato maybe has a valid point? Especially since things are more subtle than that. A non-techie cannot tell the difference between a seatbelt and a potato, and that's why the law says your car needs to have actual seatbelts.
- malermeister 5y ago

trutannus 5y ago

Its starting to look like the benefits of decentralized banks lean more in favor of the bank robbers than the bank clients.

knorker 5y ago
Luckily none of the bank clients actually have any intention of moving their banking into DeFi. They just move some speculation and crime there. Among the clients nobody innocent gets hurt, as there is nobody innocent. Now ransomware and such...
- trutannus 5y ago
  Not sure I agree. I'm sure there's plenty of innocents who've been forcefully convinced by some crypto zelot, or FOMOed their way into the crypto world. In terms of normal bank clients moving to a DAO bank or something silly like that, you're right, nobody in their right minds is doing this.
  - knorker 5y ago
    Maybe. Depends how "innocent" someone is when they are blinded by greed, even if greed fueled by scammers. Would that same person be culpable if they did as little due diligance before "investing" in more traditional organized crime, lured in by "you can't lose. It's a sure bet, 10x gains!"? At best the innocents here "invested" in a lottery ticket, and lost in the same way that a non-winning lottery ticket loses.
    - trutannus 5y ago
      Not everything is this black and white. Some people are not motivated by greed as much as misplaced fear that's been stirred up by the crypto folks. Open any crypto discussion and see how many clicks it takes to get to someone panicking over hyperinflation, bank failures, invoking the ghost of 2008, ect. For all their talk of FUD, crypto folks dish the FUD out onto the traditional banking system almost as hard as the traditional banking system dishes it out on crypto. Mix that with someone who's easily impressionable and anxious, and you get someone who'll likely make some very bad decisions.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]