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It’s not the victim’s fault. But still… it’s only prudent to take precautions.

floatingatoll 5y ago
Prudence is certainly a choice one can make, but in no way should it be recommended or required. Google is supposed to be trusted with the world's emails, photos, and other Android data backups. If it is necessary to take precautions against Google misusing data, then that cuts to the heart of their business model, and is a material threat to consumers that they should be informed about.
- beervirus 5y ago
  Prudence shouldn’t be recommended? Lol what nonsense is this?
- BiteCode_dev 5y ago
  > Prudence is certainly a choice one can make, but in no way should it be recommended or required. risk = probability X severity. If something is a big deal to you, take precautions, even if it's unlikely, because the severity is high. This is why we take huge precaution with nuclear plants, because the likelyhood of an accident is low, but the severity is high. If you have nude on your phone, severity is high. The probability that googles will mess with you is low, but it's good advice to tell you to protect yourself.
  - floatingatoll 5y ago
    > If you have nude on your phone, severity is high. Incorrect, for societal reasons. For women, the severity of nudes being stolen is very high, regardless of social stature. The majority of nudes published without consent are of women, and the majority of 'revenge porn' nudes published explicitly to demean are of women, and the majority of societal outrage excluding public figures is directed at women. The long-term impacts of nudes being published without consent never fade, and is nearly as likely to result in loss of employment and social stature years later. For men, the severity of nudes being stolen directly correlates with whether they perceive their career or social stature to be at risk if nudes are stolen are shared, as in the majority of cases men are blackmailed for payment before stolen nudes are published. The long-term impacts of nudes being published without consent fades rapidly for private individuals, hinges on their career and social profiles rather than being effectively universal across their gender, and is often disregarded altogether. For public figures, the employment and societal circumstances vary wildly, and the overall risk of permanent harm to men increases considerably; however, the risk of permanent harm to women decreases only slightly, and typically only for women who already publish nudity of their own accord, and thus have already factored in the societal harm of doing so. My time is limited, so here's one contributing citation only: Intimate image abuse in adults and under 18s (2019) https://swgfl.org.uk/assets/documents/intimate-image-abuse-in-adults-and-under-18s.pdf https://swgfl.org.uk/assets/documents/intimate-image-abuse-i...
faeyanpiraat 5y ago
This is the key; arguing about who to blame will not change the fact that any device which stores or could access unencrypted personal data might be accessed by someone unauthorized. Bringing awareness to the issue could help.
rconti 5y ago
Taking precautions is what you do (in this case, if you can afford to do so) in order to prevent bad things happening to you. It is NOT what you do in order to determine fault if a bad thing DOES happen.
- philosopher1234 5y ago
  I don't see a contradiction here. It's terrible that Google allowed this to happen, and the individuals responsible should be held to account. Also, it is a good idea to be very protective of nude photos. I found the original comment useful for thinking about how I could avoid this situation personally.
  - rconti 5y ago
    It's a great thing to teach your children. Not to tell adults after their privacy has been violated. Do you really find it a useful comment? Was it not an immediately obvious conclusion that none of this would have happened if they had just fired their phone into outer space rather than hope to have their warranty honored?
    - philosopher1234 5y ago
      I actually did find it useful. Yes its obvious that destroying a phone would prevent photos leaking, but it didn't occur to me that this might be a good default position for me to take when considering sending in my phone for repairs, as horrific as that is. I would probably have just trusted google/apple too.
- beervirus 5y ago
  I didn’t say otherwise. It’s obviously the bad actor’s fault, not the owner of the phone. But still. Come on.
6gvONxR4sf7o 5y ago
Sure, but the the need to take precautions is itself the problem.
- AwaAwa 5y ago
  It's only a problem if you don't live in the real world. The real world is filled with learned behaviors that keep us from expiring quickly like a lazy squirrel on the road.
ben_w 5y ago
While true, the counterpoint is that in practice nobody can take sufficient precautions, we only think we can until it goes wrong.
- BiteCode_dev 5y ago
  Trust, but goes with Pareto precautions. Arabs have a wonderful proverb for that: "trust in God, yet tie your camel"

Prudence is certainly a choice one can make, but in no way should it be recommended or required. Google is supposed to be trusted with the world's emails, photos, and other Android data backups. If it is necessary to take precautions against Google misusing data, then that cuts to the heart of their business model, and is a material threat to consumers that they should be informed about.

beervirus 5y ago
Prudence shouldn’t be recommended? Lol what nonsense is this?
BiteCode_dev 5y ago
> Prudence is certainly a choice one can make, but in no way should it be recommended or required. risk = probability X severity. If something is a big deal to you, take precautions, even if it's unlikely, because the severity is high. This is why we take huge precaution with nuclear plants, because the likelyhood of an accident is low, but the severity is high. If you have nude on your phone, severity is high. The probability that googles will mess with you is low, but it's good advice to tell you to protect yourself.
- floatingatoll 5y ago
  > If you have nude on your phone, severity is high. Incorrect, for societal reasons. For women, the severity of nudes being stolen is very high, regardless of social stature. The majority of nudes published without consent are of women, and the majority of 'revenge porn' nudes published explicitly to demean are of women, and the majority of societal outrage excluding public figures is directed at women. The long-term impacts of nudes being published without consent never fade, and is nearly as likely to result in loss of employment and social stature years later. For men, the severity of nudes being stolen directly correlates with whether they perceive their career or social stature to be at risk if nudes are stolen are shared, as in the majority of cases men are blackmailed for payment before stolen nudes are published. The long-term impacts of nudes being published without consent fades rapidly for private individuals, hinges on their career and social profiles rather than being effectively universal across their gender, and is often disregarded altogether. For public figures, the employment and societal circumstances vary wildly, and the overall risk of permanent harm to men increases considerably; however, the risk of permanent harm to women decreases only slightly, and typically only for women who already publish nudity of their own accord, and thus have already factored in the societal harm of doing so. My time is limited, so here's one contributing citation only: Intimate image abuse in adults and under 18s (2019) https://swgfl.org.uk/assets/documents/intimate-image-abuse-in-adults-and-under-18s.pdf https://swgfl.org.uk/assets/documents/intimate-image-abuse-i...

faeyanpiraat 5y ago

This is the key; arguing about who to blame will not change the fact that any device which stores or could access unencrypted personal data might be accessed by someone unauthorized. Bringing awareness to the issue could help.

rconti 5y ago

Taking precautions is what you do (in this case, if you can afford to do so) in order to prevent bad things happening to you. It is NOT what you do in order to determine fault if a bad thing DOES happen.

philosopher1234 5y ago
I don't see a contradiction here. It's terrible that Google allowed this to happen, and the individuals responsible should be held to account. Also, it is a good idea to be very protective of nude photos. I found the original comment useful for thinking about how I could avoid this situation personally.
- rconti 5y ago
  It's a great thing to teach your children. Not to tell adults after their privacy has been violated. Do you really find it a useful comment? Was it not an immediately obvious conclusion that none of this would have happened if they had just fired their phone into outer space rather than hope to have their warranty honored?
  - philosopher1234 5y ago
    I actually did find it useful. Yes its obvious that destroying a phone would prevent photos leaking, but it didn't occur to me that this might be a good default position for me to take when considering sending in my phone for repairs, as horrific as that is. I would probably have just trusted google/apple too.
beervirus 5y ago
I didn’t say otherwise. It’s obviously the bad actor’s fault, not the owner of the phone. But still. Come on.

6gvONxR4sf7o 5y ago

Sure, but the the need to take precautions is itself the problem.

AwaAwa 5y ago
It's only a problem if you don't live in the real world. The real world is filled with learned behaviors that keep us from expiring quickly like a lazy squirrel on the road.

ben_w 5y ago

While true, the counterpoint is that in practice nobody can take sufficient precautions, we only think we can until it goes wrong.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago
Trust, but goes with Pareto precautions. Arabs have a wonderful proverb for that: "trust in God, yet tie your camel"