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Do either work as a daily phone for the owners? A Linux desktop can’t even run ARM android apps, yet it’s expected outdated ARM hardware will. You say you’re b

Do either work as a daily phone for the owners? A Linux desktop can’t even run ARM android apps, yet it’s expected outdated ARM hardware will. You say you’re been in GNU/Linux on mobile but assert PMOS didn’t have significant progress, had other running phones way before like the Nexus 5 and assert these new phones were the drivers of progress, what evidence is there they didn’t just drain resources from other projects?

seba_dos1 5y ago
I'm using a Librem 5 with PureOS as my daily driver. I can even run the Android app of my bank there, although I have to admit that this part can be wonky (but to be honest, that's not a big deal to me). Before that, I'd been using Nokia N900 for many years after switching from Openmoko Neo Freerunner, which I'd been using for something around 2 or 3 years. Actually, I still keep my N900 around as a backup. I remember when postmarketOS has been created, but that was already pretty late in my book :) You completely forget about earlier porting pioneers, such as SHR that worked on devices like HTC Dream, Nexus S or Palm Pre (and GTA01/02/04, obviously); or even projects that predate my personal involvement, like OpenEZX. We've seen it happening multiple times by now, so there's a lot of insight to take from that already. > had other running phones way before like the Nexus 5 It is pretty clear that you haven't actually used pmOS back then (2017-18), as none of the supported devices could even do phone calls there, and that was far from the only missing basic feature. Which DE would you even run on it for daily usage, Hildon? ;) It sure was an amazing project with a lot of promise already, but absolutely nowhere near being actually usable (aside of some PDA-like use cases). Back then the only linuxy OS that you could actually use on some real-world devices (not counting proprietary ones like Sailfish or already obsolete ones like SHR) was Ubuntu Touch, which was pretty far from the regular desktop architecture (still is and doesn't intend to change that) that's pitched by distros like pmOS, PureOS or Mobian. Things started to move with the advent of Librem 5 (2018) and PinePhone (2020), thanks to Purism investing resources into creating phosh and maintaining supporting infrastructure in GNOME, and Plasma Mobile experiencing an influx of new developers and moving away from Hybris when PinePhone started to become widely available. That work is now directly consumed by ports of pmOS to other devices as well. > what evidence is there they didn’t just drain resources from other projects So, considering all I said above - which other projects? Distros like postmarketOS have been fueled by L5 and PP, not drained. Work on mobile GNOME has been paid for with Librem 5's price. Plasma Mobile was a tech demo until more people started to hack it on the PinePhone. This should be evident to anyone who actually watched that space unfold across the last 15 years. These days we can even start hoping for working phone calls on ported devices like OnePlus 6T, but where do you think the ModemManager code to handle phone calls actually came from? ;]
- GhettoComputers 5y ago
  >I'm using a Librem 5 with PureOS as my daily driver. How usable is it? Does it have power management? I heard it still doesn't have good battery life or... anything. Did the switch from N900 hurt? >I still keep my N900 around as a backup. How can you when 3G will be sunsetted? I didn't mention other projects, but speaking of them why didn't you ever get interested in Replicant? I didn't forget other projects, but it makes little sense to mention them when they aren't relevant. >It is pretty clear that you haven't actually used pmOS back then (2017-18), as none of the supported devices could even do phone calls there, and that was far from the only missing basic feature. I've tried it then and tried it now. Phone calls don't matter to me, I only used VOIP, but my point is that there was work on GNU/linux phones way before L5 or PP, which still has many missing features. With all new android phones being mainlined as well as "old" ones like the S9 way before either was released. https://github.com/exynos-linux-stable https://github.com/exynos-linux-stable Samsung DEX is much more useful and interesting to me than having partially running 2005-2015 hardware that has weak functionality. >Which DE would you even run on it for daily usage None of them then, or today either. Maemo was partially propietary, did it stop you from using it? If not, why ignore Sailfish and not count it? https://www.xda-developers.com/android-project-mainline-modules-explanation/ https://www.xda-developers.com/android-project-mainline-modu... This project is the most interesting. That all being said I do admire your dedication to using gnu/linux, but my question is what do you gain from using it? I can use the CLI tools I care about with both iOS and Android, what is the benefit to running Linux that made you ignore iOS and Android? It was awesome having mobile Unix in an iPhone in 2007 with a jailbreak with easily ported tools and apt since the first jailbreak, it was also great to have them on android. What does mobile linux do better?
  - seba_dos1 5y ago
    > How usable is it? Does it have power management? I heard it still doesn't have good battery life or... anything. Did the switch from N900 hurt? It's perfectly usable in my eyes - well, at least as long as I don't break anything, which can happen :) Lasts on a battery around 10-15 hours, less when under heavy use. Generally long enough for my needs, and there's still a room for improvement in software, so that will likely get better with time. The switch from N900 did not hurt at all (maybe aside of losing the hardware keyboard and having to get used to a 5" phone in my pocket). > How can you when 3G will be sunsetted? I'm not aware of any plans to sunset 3G where I live. > I didn't mention other projects, but speaking of them why didn't you ever get interested in Replicant? I used to play with Replicant a bit on GTA04 and Galaxy S3, but in the end I'm not interested in Android at all (it's a cool project though and I fully support it). > With all new android phones being mainlined as well as "old" ones like the S9 way before either was released. That's far from enough to have a properly functioning GNU/Linux userspace on them (although it is much better than it used to be indeed). > but my point is that there was work on GNU/linux phones way before L5 or PP Of course there was, I spent years of my life on it. > Samsung DEX Isn't that discontinued? > Maemo was partially propietary, did it stop you from using it? If not, why ignore Sailfish and not count it? If you read carefully, I haven't mentioned Maemo at all, for exactly this reason. I only mentioned N900 which I got to port SHR to, but ended up using it with Maemo as my daily driver - which wasn't ideal, but was best that was available back then (I switched to it pretty late anyway, since I stayed on a GTA02 for a few years). I didn't want to switch to more of the same; I wanted to do an upgrade, which is why I only switched when I got a Librem 5. > That all being said I do admire your dedication to using gnu/linux, but my question is what do you gain from using it? I am the administrator of my system, just like I am on my desktop, and I find that incredibly powerful. I can easily patch and replace every part of it, even right on the phone, while Android build system is a massive PITA. I often build deb packages straight on my Librem 5. I don't have to break into anything, it's mine. In the past, I made a mistake of getting a Kindle and at some point updating it to a version that didn't have a jailbreak available yet, so I told myself to never willingly rely on jailbreaking again.

seba_dos1 5y ago

I'm using a Librem 5 with PureOS as my daily driver. I can even run the Android app of my bank there, although I have to admit that this part can be wonky (but to be honest, that's not a big deal to me). Before that, I'd been using Nokia N900 for many years after switching from Openmoko Neo Freerunner, which I'd been using for something around 2 or 3 years. Actually, I still keep my N900 around as a backup. I remember when postmarketOS has been created, but that was already pretty late in my book :) You completely forget about earlier porting pioneers, such as SHR that worked on devices like HTC Dream, Nexus S or Palm Pre (and GTA01/02/04, obviously); or even projects that predate my personal involvement, like OpenEZX. We've seen it happening multiple times by now, so there's a lot of insight to take from that already. > had other running phones way before like the Nexus 5 It is pretty clear that you haven't actually used pmOS back then (2017-18), as none of the supported devices could even do phone calls there, and that was far from the only missing basic feature. Which DE would you even run on it for daily usage, Hildon? ;) It sure was an amazing project with a lot of promise already, but absolutely nowhere near being actually usable (aside of some PDA-like use cases). Back then the only linuxy OS that you could actually use on some real-world devices (not counting proprietary ones like Sailfish or already obsolete ones like SHR) was Ubuntu Touch, which was pretty far from the regular desktop architecture (still is and doesn't intend to change that) that's pitched by distros like pmOS, PureOS or Mobian. Things started to move with the advent of Librem 5 (2018) and PinePhone (2020), thanks to Purism investing resources into creating phosh and maintaining supporting infrastructure in GNOME, and Plasma Mobile experiencing an influx of new developers and moving away from Hybris when PinePhone started to become widely available. That work is now directly consumed by ports of pmOS to other devices as well. > what evidence is there they didn’t just drain resources from other projects So, considering all I said above - which other projects? Distros like postmarketOS have been fueled by L5 and PP, not drained. Work on mobile GNOME has been paid for with Librem 5's price. Plasma Mobile was a tech demo until more people started to hack it on the PinePhone. This should be evident to anyone who actually watched that space unfold across the last 15 years. These days we can even start hoping for working phone calls on ported devices like OnePlus 6T, but where do you think the ModemManager code to handle phone calls actually came from? ;]

GhettoComputers 5y ago
>I'm using a Librem 5 with PureOS as my daily driver. How usable is it? Does it have power management? I heard it still doesn't have good battery life or... anything. Did the switch from N900 hurt? >I still keep my N900 around as a backup. How can you when 3G will be sunsetted? I didn't mention other projects, but speaking of them why didn't you ever get interested in Replicant? I didn't forget other projects, but it makes little sense to mention them when they aren't relevant. >It is pretty clear that you haven't actually used pmOS back then (2017-18), as none of the supported devices could even do phone calls there, and that was far from the only missing basic feature. I've tried it then and tried it now. Phone calls don't matter to me, I only used VOIP, but my point is that there was work on GNU/linux phones way before L5 or PP, which still has many missing features. With all new android phones being mainlined as well as "old" ones like the S9 way before either was released. https://github.com/exynos-linux-stable https://github.com/exynos-linux-stable Samsung DEX is much more useful and interesting to me than having partially running 2005-2015 hardware that has weak functionality. >Which DE would you even run on it for daily usage None of them then, or today either. Maemo was partially propietary, did it stop you from using it? If not, why ignore Sailfish and not count it? https://www.xda-developers.com/android-project-mainline-modules-explanation/ https://www.xda-developers.com/android-project-mainline-modu... This project is the most interesting. That all being said I do admire your dedication to using gnu/linux, but my question is what do you gain from using it? I can use the CLI tools I care about with both iOS and Android, what is the benefit to running Linux that made you ignore iOS and Android? It was awesome having mobile Unix in an iPhone in 2007 with a jailbreak with easily ported tools and apt since the first jailbreak, it was also great to have them on android. What does mobile linux do better?
- seba_dos1 5y ago
  > How usable is it? Does it have power management? I heard it still doesn't have good battery life or... anything. Did the switch from N900 hurt? It's perfectly usable in my eyes - well, at least as long as I don't break anything, which can happen :) Lasts on a battery around 10-15 hours, less when under heavy use. Generally long enough for my needs, and there's still a room for improvement in software, so that will likely get better with time. The switch from N900 did not hurt at all (maybe aside of losing the hardware keyboard and having to get used to a 5" phone in my pocket). > How can you when 3G will be sunsetted? I'm not aware of any plans to sunset 3G where I live. > I didn't mention other projects, but speaking of them why didn't you ever get interested in Replicant? I used to play with Replicant a bit on GTA04 and Galaxy S3, but in the end I'm not interested in Android at all (it's a cool project though and I fully support it). > With all new android phones being mainlined as well as "old" ones like the S9 way before either was released. That's far from enough to have a properly functioning GNU/Linux userspace on them (although it is much better than it used to be indeed). > but my point is that there was work on GNU/linux phones way before L5 or PP Of course there was, I spent years of my life on it. > Samsung DEX Isn't that discontinued? > Maemo was partially propietary, did it stop you from using it? If not, why ignore Sailfish and not count it? If you read carefully, I haven't mentioned Maemo at all, for exactly this reason. I only mentioned N900 which I got to port SHR to, but ended up using it with Maemo as my daily driver - which wasn't ideal, but was best that was available back then (I switched to it pretty late anyway, since I stayed on a GTA02 for a few years). I didn't want to switch to more of the same; I wanted to do an upgrade, which is why I only switched when I got a Librem 5. > That all being said I do admire your dedication to using gnu/linux, but my question is what do you gain from using it? I am the administrator of my system, just like I am on my desktop, and I find that incredibly powerful. I can easily patch and replace every part of it, even right on the phone, while Android build system is a massive PITA. I often build deb packages straight on my Librem 5. I don't have to break into anything, it's mine. In the past, I made a mistake of getting a Kindle and at some point updating it to a version that didn't have a jailbreak available yet, so I told myself to never willingly rely on jailbreaking again.