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> Do we see a greater percentage of entrepreneurs from Canada or Europe than from the US? Yes, if one uses self-employment as a proxy for entrepreneurship. The

• 908B64B197 5y ago
  How much of that, especially in Europe, is simply a way to bypass the ever increasing burden of regulations around employment?
  • goodpoint 5y ago
    Close to none. Companies love to have employees.
  • fnord77 5y ago
    In Sweden, many software engineers work as contract engineers for better pay. Salaries for hired software engineers in Europe are dismal.
    • bilekas 5y ago
      > Salaries for hired software engineers in Europe are dismal I strongly disagree, it might be all relative of course, but dismal is not a word that would even come close.
      • mcv 5y ago
        No, they're still solid jobs compared to what lots of other people get paid. But managers and other corporate types still get paid a lot more. And self-employed, you can also get paid that much, just not as an employee.
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  • verelo 5y ago
    That question really makes it sound like you have an agenda.
    • 908B64B197 5y ago
      Many Europeans told me they preferred hiring contractors early on because the potential cost of a bad hire was just too much for a startup.
      • bilekas 5y ago
        For a startup you probably don't have the capital / financial support to ensure redundancy packages etc. If you need someone to come in on your greenfield project and hit the ground running, thats what contractors are usually used for; the beginning and the end of the lifecycle.
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  • jorisboris 5y ago
    In Belgium, once you reach a certain pay (roughly from 100k euros yearly onwards), it reduces tax burden for employer and employee when employees become independent contractors.
    • davidgay 5y ago
      In the US, IIUC, the IRS won't let you (employer, employee) do that.
      • mcv 5y ago
        The Dutch tax service keeps trying to figure out new rules of how to distinguish between true self-employed people and fake self-employeds who basically function as regular employees, but without the rights and benefits of employees. This is mainly meant to protect excessive exploitation of low-paid (gig-economy) workers, but it certainly limits my options as well. I'm self-employed and tend to work for a single client at a time, usually on projects of between half a year and two years. I work on a team with employees, doing similar work, except I'm more empowered, more in control of my own way of working (also because the tax service demands that, which is good in this case). I'm not being exploited the way employees or gig workers are. And if the government thinks this is some kind of tax loophole, I'd happily pay more tax, as long as I can continue working this way.
  • bilekas 5y ago
    It really doesn't have too much with regulations etc usually. For engineers for example, you will earn higher income and pay less tax, different rates. And larger companies usually have a set asside budget for contractors. Its easier as an engineer as its never hard to find another job. If this wasn't the case, you would see a higher percentage of employees who require job securoty. Nothing to do with regulation from my experience, just better pay and more flexibility.
  • smus 5y ago
    That whooshing sound is the goal posts moving
• ameister14 5y ago
  With what, 60 million gig workers in the US? Around 38% of the labor force, I think- you'd think the total self-employed number would be higher.
  • intrasight 5y ago
    Gig workers are not self-employed. They don't pass the IRS 20 factor test. And that's why governments are cracking down.
    • mcv 5y ago
      Different countries may have different standards for that, though. So it may be hard to compare this data between different countries.
  • jfoutz 5y ago
    How are people with multiple jobs counted? I’d imagine the gig thing is generally not primary.
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• MeinBlutIstBlau 5y ago
  >The US trails Canada and Western European countries in self employment as a percentage of the labour force. I distinctly remember being told by an Austrian I met once that they need a sizable amount of liquid assets up front before they can even qualify for operating a business.
• frankfrankfrank 5y ago
  Here's a dirty little secret … and I know this is going to upset many of the statist types … but vast majority of those OECD types of datasets are so utterly polluted that they are essentially useless beyond the broadest of strokes. Just alone the definition and the application of that definition and the capacity to accurately capture the data alone produces excessive inaccuracies that in essence rely on the formality of the process and the institutional perception as a means to claim or even just project assumed authority and accuracy of the data. To put it in a different context; the self-delusional con job that was the lie about how wonderful and amazing the Afghan national army was for the last about 10 years minimum, is a perfect example of just how broad, deep, and long a blatant fraud can be perpetuated in such an open and overt manner, all underpinned by all kinds of shiny presentations and back rubbing soliloquies. It's all fake. I know that makes people's cognitive dissonance flare up, but that's the uncomfortable truth. The emperor in fact has no clothes on, nor do any of his courtiers. We will see how long the charade can last.
  • phdelightful 5y ago
    If your point is "lies, damn lies, and statistics," then I guess I can't argue with that. If your point is something more specific about OECD self-employment data, or the processes and practices for a specific or category of "OECD types of datasets" or general practices of society-level datasets...I encourage you to make that point, and give others something to work with.
  • ElemenoPicuares 5y ago
    Dirtier and Secreter: People's cognitive dissonance would flare way up if you shared convincing evidence that the OECD or the similar bodies fake their self-employment data.
• jandrewrogers 5y ago
  Self-employment isn’t a good proxy for entrepreneurship. Many (most?) entrepreneurs are not technically self-employed in the US. In Europe, there is a strong bias toward being an “independent contractor” because that is almost the only way to earn a top wage, whereas in the US that is entirely unnecessary since normal companies readily pay regular employees top dollar if they perform. Being self-employed in Europe is a product of the reality that companies are willing to pay contractors much more than the equivalent employees. If you are highly skilled, being self-employed is the only way to earn what you are worth.
• mcv 5y ago
  Interesting data set. Norway and Denmark score surprisingly low; lower than Canada, only just above the US. Colombia is the extreme outlier on the high end with 50%. Netherland is in the upper third with 17%, but is the second highest wealthy country (after New Zealand). Most countries of similar GDP/capita have a far lower amount of self-employment.
• faet 5y ago
  >New research shows that 44 million workers—or 28.2%—were self-employed at some point during a given week in 2019. Much of it depends on how they define self employed. "Contract Work" doesn't count as self employed for the government. >Those figures appear to go against other surveys showing huge growth in contract work, which is transforming the U.S. labor market. A survey conducted in December by NPR/Marist found that contract work makes up 20 percent or more of the U.S. workforce. >Why the seemingly large discrepancy? >Many point to the government's methodology. The Labor Department, for example, did not include people who augment their income through contract work