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I remember spending a summer on the Twitter campus and the whole time I was wondering - why the heck does Twitter need all these employees (5500 as of last coun

I remember spending a summer on the Twitter campus and the whole time I was wondering - why the heck does Twitter need all these employees (5500 as of last count [0])? The functionality hasn't budged much in years. I get the need for IT ops to keep stuff running (especially since failwhale days). But honestly, I never got why Twitter couldn't do with 1/10 the staff they have / had. I hope this great resignation wave continues across the company. [0] https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/TWTR/twitter/number-of-employees https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/TWTR/twitter/numbe...

taurath 5y ago
Automated ad networks still require a lot of engineering and relationship management
- rexreed 5y ago
  What's the usual ratio of engineering / relationship management per ad dollar revenue?
  - oceanplexian 5y ago
    Investors have priced the company at a market cap of $36.8 Billion, so approx. $6.8M per employee. I guess you could subtract their assets and IP but I doubt it will change the figure much.
    - rexreed 5y ago
      That doesn't make sense. Employees per revenue is not measured by market cap, but by revenue. Revenue was $3.7B as last reported. So you're 10x off by that measure. Also, not all employees are engineering and ad relationship management.
- ksec 5y ago
  I would have thought even 2000 engineers on Ad Network is still pretty insane. And their Operating Expense keeps growing with Gross Profits.
milesward 5y ago
Ahh yet another person who sees the user facing systems as "the product", or worse "the hard part". Sigh.
- rexreed 5y ago
  Which systems are the "hard" parts? Given zero functionality change, how much larger can and should Twitter grow? Is the complication a function of ad revenue, volume of content, user traffic?
  - vimda 5y ago
    Just because you don't see functionality changing doesn't mean it isn't. Lots of new features, just not for the normal users. Not to mention all the backend work to make all this data flow around, be accurate, and be reliable. And also, there's not just engineering. HR, Accounting, Lawyers, Trust and Safety, it's all there
    - rexreed 5y ago
      The point I'm trying to make is assume that user-side functionality stays exactly the same - frozen - for say 10 years. Given what you say above, it would be reasonable to expect the company to continue to grow in any case on its current 10-20% compounded annual rate with no end in sight. Is that truly sustainable?
      - ctvo 5y ago
        Which users? Internal users? External users? External developers (I know, I know) or academics consuming their APIs? Advertisers? Starting from the position of what don't I know about this situation, and / or what systems could cause it to be in this seemingly intractable state leaves you open to all sorts of new learnings vs. assuming there aren't intelligent, capable people on the other side.
      - mfringel 5y ago
        Twitter is a platform that offers a product. Your attention is the product. The part of Twitter required to maintain a decent stock of product has not needed to change outwardly, because it hasn't had to. There hasn't been a new version of human in a very long time. But even then, anything that creates more product (drives more engagement) means more revenue opportunity for the 90% of the platform you will never touch. The parts of the product that theoretically make revenue for Twitter have changed significantly over time. Analytics, ad intake/spend, promotion for influencers/brands/etc.
winternett 5y ago
They need all those employees because apparently there is not really any algorithm at work... An insider leaked at some point on Reddit a while back that there are just a bunch of people applying back end controls on each user account to limit their posting activity in one of a few ways, and when I saw it it did a lot to ease my mind about how the erratic way Twitter works. I personally think that some accounts simply get shadowbanned for life unless they pass the "money making controversial post attention" threshold. Smoke and mirrors and pay-for-play have completely corrupted social media now since the pandemic. "Success" on social platforms depends on how much you can afford to pay for it. I understand everyone has bills to pay, but these services started out as free services and converted stealthily and at times deceptively into paid services, and that shouldn't be just overlooked or given a pass.
- rexreed 5y ago
  This is the answer I was expecting. There's clearly a non-scaling factor at work here.

taurath 5y ago

Automated ad networks still require a lot of engineering and relationship management

rexreed 5y ago
What's the usual ratio of engineering / relationship management per ad dollar revenue?
- oceanplexian 5y ago
  Investors have priced the company at a market cap of $36.8 Billion, so approx. $6.8M per employee. I guess you could subtract their assets and IP but I doubt it will change the figure much.
  - rexreed 5y ago
    That doesn't make sense. Employees per revenue is not measured by market cap, but by revenue. Revenue was $3.7B as last reported. So you're 10x off by that measure. Also, not all employees are engineering and ad relationship management.
ksec 5y ago
I would have thought even 2000 engineers on Ad Network is still pretty insane. And their Operating Expense keeps growing with Gross Profits.

milesward 5y ago

Ahh yet another person who sees the user facing systems as "the product", or worse "the hard part". Sigh.

rexreed 5y ago
Which systems are the "hard" parts? Given zero functionality change, how much larger can and should Twitter grow? Is the complication a function of ad revenue, volume of content, user traffic?
- vimda 5y ago
  Just because you don't see functionality changing doesn't mean it isn't. Lots of new features, just not for the normal users. Not to mention all the backend work to make all this data flow around, be accurate, and be reliable. And also, there's not just engineering. HR, Accounting, Lawyers, Trust and Safety, it's all there
  - rexreed 5y ago
    The point I'm trying to make is assume that user-side functionality stays exactly the same - frozen - for say 10 years. Given what you say above, it would be reasonable to expect the company to continue to grow in any case on its current 10-20% compounded annual rate with no end in sight. Is that truly sustainable?
    - ctvo 5y ago
      Which users? Internal users? External users? External developers (I know, I know) or academics consuming their APIs? Advertisers? Starting from the position of what don't I know about this situation, and / or what systems could cause it to be in this seemingly intractable state leaves you open to all sorts of new learnings vs. assuming there aren't intelligent, capable people on the other side.
    - mfringel 5y ago
      Twitter is a platform that offers a product. Your attention is the product. The part of Twitter required to maintain a decent stock of product has not needed to change outwardly, because it hasn't had to. There hasn't been a new version of human in a very long time. But even then, anything that creates more product (drives more engagement) means more revenue opportunity for the 90% of the platform you will never touch. The parts of the product that theoretically make revenue for Twitter have changed significantly over time. Analytics, ad intake/spend, promotion for influencers/brands/etc.

winternett 5y ago

They need all those employees because apparently there is not really any algorithm at work... An insider leaked at some point on Reddit a while back that there are just a bunch of people applying back end controls on each user account to limit their posting activity in one of a few ways, and when I saw it it did a lot to ease my mind about how the erratic way Twitter works. I personally think that some accounts simply get shadowbanned for life unless they pass the "money making controversial post attention" threshold. Smoke and mirrors and pay-for-play have completely corrupted social media now since the pandemic. "Success" on social platforms depends on how much you can afford to pay for it. I understand everyone has bills to pay, but these services started out as free services and converted stealthily and at times deceptively into paid services, and that shouldn't be just overlooked or given a pass.

rexreed 5y ago
This is the answer I was expecting. There's clearly a non-scaling factor at work here.