5 ms·

it was primarily android and gradle issues honestly within its jetbrains IDE. jetbrains itself has performance issues, and you need to muck around too much to

by jatone 5y ago

it was primarily android and gradle issues honestly within its jetbrains IDE. jetbrains itself has performance issues, and you need to muck around too much to get them working properly. the JVM also causes issues resulting it having to tune the environment params to get decent performance. JB makes tons of assumptions and attempts to be helpful in ways that just are not; precompiling automatically, running massive indexing jobs causing the machine to bog down, assuming it has the right to modify your environment. these are all things I just do not want to think about when in essence I'm navigating directories and editing files with fancy hover tooltips. the standalone versions are okay usually depends on the language. I just want an editor with code linting regardless of the language. vscode in that respect has been a god send. install language server and you're done. performance is generally good and the background tasks seem thus far havent completely bogged down my machine.

wpietri 5y ago
Yeah, if you just want a text editor and not an IDE, you probably shouldn't be using an IDE. Those things that are "just not" helpful to you are very helpful to others. Personally, I very much want an actual IDE for a lot of my work. So I'm happy to buy a fast machine with plenty of RAM and then give the IDE a good chunk of it. But I'm glad they're making Fleet for folks with other preferences, and I'm sure I'll be using it myself when I just need to open one or two files and make quick edits.
- jatone 5y ago
  no I want my IDE to be functional without destroying my system performance or fucking up my codebase. jet brains is a massive offender here. it doesn't need to be. I have a giant machine ~128GB of RAM and 24 cores. the fact I have to tune my IDE is insane. the not helpful issues with jetbrains are when it crashes, slows down my system, prevents me from modifying files because reasons, modifies my build configurations in unsafe ways because it thinks it knows best, interferes with CLI run commands because it doesn't safely check that it can modify files owned by other applications. I'll grant you these are generally issues with the individual plugins within jetbrains. why deal with all that when I don't have to? Why deal with the performance issues the JVM has when I don't have to? vscode I get autocomplete, debuggers, decent linting, decent performance. that's an IDE in a nutshell. not a text editor. I'm happy you enjoy JB, great. it doesn't change any of the above and havent seen any indicators that the above has changed or will change in the future for it. hence I don't use it. fleet may be promising in this regard. but don't feel the need to jump ship when I already have remote code editing in vscode. which is the only real first class feature fleet has to distinguish itself from other IDEs.
  - wpietri 5y ago
    That's just very different than my experience. Across a number of years and a few different major languages, from coding solo to working with teams. The only tuning I have to do is to tell it that using more RAM is ok. I'm sorry you're having those problems, and if you ever want to dig in on fixing them, drop me a line. But please understand it's pretty far off the median experience.
    - jatone 5y ago
      while I appreciate the offer; there is nothing to dig into here. jetbrains just doesn't bring anything to the table compared to other options. and it lost my trust on reliability in a massive way due to android studio and never really performing well at its core function, writing software, compared to things like sublime, vscode, even vim/emacs; once configured. and if I'm going to pay for something like an IDE it needs to be rock solid when the free competition is competent.
      - wpietri 5y ago
        It may not bring anything to the table for you. I would find it helpful if you phrased your criticisms in a way that didn't deny the possibility that others might find plenty of value.
        jatone 5y ago
        perfectly happy how I've phrased my criticisms. if jetbrains wants glowing reviews, then they can make a glowing product. I've been upfront where my issues reside, how they impacted me and they are well known issues with the tool. I'm not the first to make these comments nor will I be the last. however, your tone in this thread implies you're not a neutral player in this. do you have any relation with intellij/jetbrains?
        wpietri 5y ago
        I pay them money to use their IDE and have for some years. No other relationship. I don't have any problem with you criticizing them. I have a problem with you stating your criticisms in ways that sound like it's more than just your experience. For example, you wrote, "you need to muck around too much to get them working properly". This is not true. I don't need that. You apparently did need to do some mucking around that was too much for you. Or you write, "JB makes tons of assumptions and attempts to be helpful in ways that just are not". Again, that might not be helpful for you. But it's very helpful to me. And clearly to lots and lots of other people given how popular their tooling is even though it costs actual money. I think this sort of universalization and projection is unhelpful and ask that you not do it.

by jatone 5y ago

wpietri 5y ago

Yeah, if you just want a text editor and not an IDE, you probably shouldn't be using an IDE. Those things that are "just not" helpful to you are very helpful to others. Personally, I very much want an actual IDE for a lot of my work. So I'm happy to buy a fast machine with plenty of RAM and then give the IDE a good chunk of it. But I'm glad they're making Fleet for folks with other preferences, and I'm sure I'll be using it myself when I just need to open one or two files and make quick edits.

jatone 5y ago
no I want my IDE to be functional without destroying my system performance or fucking up my codebase. jet brains is a massive offender here. it doesn't need to be. I have a giant machine ~128GB of RAM and 24 cores. the fact I have to tune my IDE is insane. the not helpful issues with jetbrains are when it crashes, slows down my system, prevents me from modifying files because reasons, modifies my build configurations in unsafe ways because it thinks it knows best, interferes with CLI run commands because it doesn't safely check that it can modify files owned by other applications. I'll grant you these are generally issues with the individual plugins within jetbrains. why deal with all that when I don't have to? Why deal with the performance issues the JVM has when I don't have to? vscode I get autocomplete, debuggers, decent linting, decent performance. that's an IDE in a nutshell. not a text editor. I'm happy you enjoy JB, great. it doesn't change any of the above and havent seen any indicators that the above has changed or will change in the future for it. hence I don't use it. fleet may be promising in this regard. but don't feel the need to jump ship when I already have remote code editing in vscode. which is the only real first class feature fleet has to distinguish itself from other IDEs.
- wpietri 5y ago
  That's just very different than my experience. Across a number of years and a few different major languages, from coding solo to working with teams. The only tuning I have to do is to tell it that using more RAM is ok. I'm sorry you're having those problems, and if you ever want to dig in on fixing them, drop me a line. But please understand it's pretty far off the median experience.
  - jatone 5y ago
    while I appreciate the offer; there is nothing to dig into here. jetbrains just doesn't bring anything to the table compared to other options. and it lost my trust on reliability in a massive way due to android studio and never really performing well at its core function, writing software, compared to things like sublime, vscode, even vim/emacs; once configured. and if I'm going to pay for something like an IDE it needs to be rock solid when the free competition is competent.
    - wpietri 5y ago
      It may not bring anything to the table for you. I would find it helpful if you phrased your criticisms in a way that didn't deny the possibility that others might find plenty of value.
      - jatone 5y ago
        perfectly happy how I've phrased my criticisms. if jetbrains wants glowing reviews, then they can make a glowing product. I've been upfront where my issues reside, how they impacted me and they are well known issues with the tool. I'm not the first to make these comments nor will I be the last. however, your tone in this thread implies you're not a neutral player in this. do you have any relation with intellij/jetbrains?
        wpietri 5y ago
        I pay them money to use their IDE and have for some years. No other relationship. I don't have any problem with you criticizing them. I have a problem with you stating your criticisms in ways that sound like it's more than just your experience. For example, you wrote, "you need to muck around too much to get them working properly". This is not true. I don't need that. You apparently did need to do some mucking around that was too much for you. Or you write, "JB makes tons of assumptions and attempts to be helpful in ways that just are not". Again, that might not be helpful for you. But it's very helpful to me. And clearly to lots and lots of other people given how popular their tooling is even though it costs actual money. I think this sort of universalization and projection is unhelpful and ask that you not do it.