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Yeah,my issue with being on call is that i can't ever really let loose if I'm expected to be contactable anytime 24/7...what if I'm out with friends, drunk, hig

by LandR 5y ago

Yeah,my issue with being on call is that i can't ever really let loose if I'm expected to be contactable anytime 24/7...what if I'm out with friends, drunk, high, on the side of a mountain? Etc. My hours are 9-5, after that is entirely me time and if you expect me to br contact able and in s state of contribute you're going to be disappointed. No amount of money is worth losing that me time.

je42 5y ago
Usually, being "on call". should mean no alcoho, and have inet + computer closed by i.e. 5-15min or so. which also means that this should be time that is paid on some hourly rate for the lower quality of live during the on-call time. Also, there should be a rotation, with enough people to make this bearable.
- wildrhythms 5y ago
  Are you describing the current state of on-call? Because that is what it is. There should be no rotation; there should be no on-call in the first place. If hiring staff to work normal hours is too expensive for the company, then the company has bigger problems than a service going down.
  - johntyree 5y ago
    I'm confused. What's your plan for fixing Gmail on a Saturday night? Hope one of the devs doesn't have a social life?
    - jodrellblank 5y ago
      Google is big enough to have teams around the world, all in their own daytime zone.
      - aledalgrande 5y ago
        It's still the weekend wherever you are if it's Saturday in North America
        lwf 5y ago
        If you have teams in Israel, you at least can cheat a bit on Sunday v.s Friday. And having at least one daytime rotation agree that "well, you're expected to be on-call during business hours on Saturday" isn't nearly as crazy as "you can't relax at any time during the weekend".
        aahortwwy 5y ago
        Or just, like... allow people to have a Sun/Mon weekend (or Mon/Tue, or whatever) instead of Sat/Sun. There are plenty of people who would be happy with that and plenty more who would accept that arrangement if it came with extra compensation. Instead, particularly at big companies, people get hired with some generic comp. package and then it's luck of the draw whether you have an on-call rotation or not, and if you do whether it's onerous or not.
        tareqak 5y ago
        Employees and employers should be able to negotiate alternative weekends in that case. These alternate days are dealt with like real weekends with the real force of law and societal expectations.
shados 5y ago
> what if I'm out with friends, drunk, high, on the side of a mountain You can plan around it, assuming a reasonable oncall schedule. If its every other week, yeah screw that. If its a week out of 4, you can plan it and still have it better than virtually every other highly paid profession there is, and many low pay ones. > My hours are 9-5, after that is entirely me time Then maybe an hourly job is better than a salaried one... Of course, if you're not paid the part, it's not worth it. But if you're paid 150, 200k or more? I hope you're not expecting 9-5.
- __blockcipher__ 5y ago
  > But if you're paid 150, 200k or more? I hope you're not expecting 9-5. Speak for yourself, but I would never accept a $150k a year gig that expected me to be on-call, say, 1 week out of every 6. $150k is absolutely a "9-5 and stop thinking about work when you get home" kind of salary, if we're talking California standards

by LandR 5y ago

je42 5y ago

Usually, being "on call". should mean no alcoho, and have inet + computer closed by i.e. 5-15min or so. which also means that this should be time that is paid on some hourly rate for the lower quality of live during the on-call time. Also, there should be a rotation, with enough people to make this bearable.

wildrhythms 5y ago
Are you describing the current state of on-call? Because that is what it is. There should be no rotation; there should be no on-call in the first place. If hiring staff to work normal hours is too expensive for the company, then the company has bigger problems than a service going down.
- johntyree 5y ago
  I'm confused. What's your plan for fixing Gmail on a Saturday night? Hope one of the devs doesn't have a social life?
  - jodrellblank 5y ago
    Google is big enough to have teams around the world, all in their own daytime zone.
    - aledalgrande 5y ago
      It's still the weekend wherever you are if it's Saturday in North America
      - lwf 5y ago
        If you have teams in Israel, you at least can cheat a bit on Sunday v.s Friday. And having at least one daytime rotation agree that "well, you're expected to be on-call during business hours on Saturday" isn't nearly as crazy as "you can't relax at any time during the weekend".
        aahortwwy 5y ago
        Or just, like... allow people to have a Sun/Mon weekend (or Mon/Tue, or whatever) instead of Sat/Sun. There are plenty of people who would be happy with that and plenty more who would accept that arrangement if it came with extra compensation. Instead, particularly at big companies, people get hired with some generic comp. package and then it's luck of the draw whether you have an on-call rotation or not, and if you do whether it's onerous or not.
      - tareqak 5y ago
        Employees and employers should be able to negotiate alternative weekends in that case. These alternate days are dealt with like real weekends with the real force of law and societal expectations.

shados 5y ago

> what if I'm out with friends, drunk, high, on the side of a mountain You can plan around it, assuming a reasonable oncall schedule. If its every other week, yeah screw that. If its a week out of 4, you can plan it and still have it better than virtually every other highly paid profession there is, and many low pay ones. > My hours are 9-5, after that is entirely me time Then maybe an hourly job is better than a salaried one... Of course, if you're not paid the part, it's not worth it. But if you're paid 150, 200k or more? I hope you're not expecting 9-5.

__blockcipher__ 5y ago
> But if you're paid 150, 200k or more? I hope you're not expecting 9-5. Speak for yourself, but I would never accept a $150k a year gig that expected me to be on-call, say, 1 week out of every 6. $150k is absolutely a "9-5 and stop thinking about work when you get home" kind of salary, if we're talking California standards