3 ms·

For comparison, the whole OrgPad.com server currently uses 8 GB of RAM and 2 vCPUs. Everybody of the developers has 24 GB+ of RAM with all the main ones having

For comparison, the whole OrgPad.com server currently uses 8 GB of RAM and 2 vCPUs. Everybody of the developers has 24 GB+ of RAM with all the main ones having 32 GB of RAM. This is because production uses "just" nginx, JVM with the application server, PostgreSQL, MinIO and a deduplicating backup using borg. The screenshot server is an extra VM, it runs headless Google Chrome with puppeteer on a 1 vCPU, 2 GB of RAM node. We developers use a desktop operating system and programs with a GUI. That by itself uses at least 1 GB of RAM extra. We have an IDE, like IntelliJ that uses about 3 GB of RAM on my machine, there are web browsers, known memory hogs. There are e-mail clients, video-chat apps and all of the production stuff besides backup too. Some of it is recompiling stuff live e.g. shadow-cljs. There is also Spotify or occasionally a video call or screen recording e.g. using OBS Studio. That uses even more memory temporarily. There is a healthy reserve with 32 GB of RAM to make the experience smooth but 16 GB doesn't cut it anymore. So we use about half of the amount of RAM eBay used on their Sun E10ks in 1999 just for development and that is ok. The RAM costs perhaps 100 € now. The 50 € difference really doesn't cut it, if I am having hangs because of swap and the GCs doing their best everywhere.

nicce 5y ago
But do you really need them all at the same time? Spotify and video call with screen recording at the same time? Screen recording and IDE at the same time? You can present your code without heavy IDEs if you are using screen recording for that. You can also replace Spotify with spotifyd for example, which takes 1/100 of the ram or less. I can also open all my apps at the same time and complain that there is no memory. It might be convenient to keep apps open on background, but you rarely need them at the same time. SSD:s are pretty fast in these days. Just open app when needed.
- Kwpolska 5y ago
  > Screen recording and IDE at the same time? If I’m presenting some code, I’d prefer to do it in a familiar environment (i.e. my IDE of choice) — so that I don't get lost, so that I know the keyboard shortcuts, and don’t add more stress and fumbling to the presentation. Also, everyone on my team uses IntelliJ IDEA, so presenting with Code might add more confusion or might make it impossible to show IDEA-specific stuff (eg. run configurations or the debugger).
- kaliszad 5y ago
  Yes, we need all of that at the same time. Having Spotify running or not doesn't really change the equation much. Not having an IDE when you want to show something in development or want to do a quick Hangout over some code is a bummer. Every new tool changes your workflow and is a distraction that doesn't benefit the customer or our work-life balance anything. Some people on our team run Windows, because they feel at home there. I am not sure you can do a quick 'choco install spotifyd' and be done with it. SSDs are fast, but switching windows is faster. People just forget, what a hassle it is to wait 5 seconds here, and 5 seconds there. We are used to hot-code reloading and basically instantaneous response like more than 95% of the time when developing. That is the power of Clojure/ ClojureScript. It eats a bit more RAM in development. We can live with that as long as the RAM fits in a normal laptop and doesn't cost a fortune. We save much, much more by not running on Heroku/ AWS. :-)

nicce 5y ago

But do you really need them all at the same time? Spotify and video call with screen recording at the same time? Screen recording and IDE at the same time? You can present your code without heavy IDEs if you are using screen recording for that. You can also replace Spotify with spotifyd for example, which takes 1/100 of the ram or less. I can also open all my apps at the same time and complain that there is no memory. It might be convenient to keep apps open on background, but you rarely need them at the same time. SSD:s are pretty fast in these days. Just open app when needed.

Kwpolska 5y ago
> Screen recording and IDE at the same time? If I’m presenting some code, I’d prefer to do it in a familiar environment (i.e. my IDE of choice) — so that I don't get lost, so that I know the keyboard shortcuts, and don’t add more stress and fumbling to the presentation. Also, everyone on my team uses IntelliJ IDEA, so presenting with Code might add more confusion or might make it impossible to show IDEA-specific stuff (eg. run configurations or the debugger).
kaliszad 5y ago
Yes, we need all of that at the same time. Having Spotify running or not doesn't really change the equation much. Not having an IDE when you want to show something in development or want to do a quick Hangout over some code is a bummer. Every new tool changes your workflow and is a distraction that doesn't benefit the customer or our work-life balance anything. Some people on our team run Windows, because they feel at home there. I am not sure you can do a quick 'choco install spotifyd' and be done with it. SSDs are fast, but switching windows is faster. People just forget, what a hassle it is to wait 5 seconds here, and 5 seconds there. We are used to hot-code reloading and basically instantaneous response like more than 95% of the time when developing. That is the power of Clojure/ ClojureScript. It eats a bit more RAM in development. We can live with that as long as the RAM fits in a normal laptop and doesn't cost a fortune. We save much, much more by not running on Heroku/ AWS. :-)