4 ms·

What was your original comment?

by clove 5y ago

star-trek-fleet 5y ago
[flagged]
- throw10920 5y ago
  > Edit: Revealing dirty political ploys and get downvoted... I have no idea what HN readers are upholding now... "Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading." - https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html I especially don't appreciate the guilt-tripping in your comment.
  - justicezyx 5y ago
    > Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading. Before you automatically cite some site guideline, think it a moment about what happens when a community is collectively positioned with some mental disease. And see how this rule is literally prevent the community from criticizing its own behavior. > guilt-tripping If someone just downvote a informational piece written by someone who clearly demonstrated specific understanding on the topic, then calling them out and let me feel a bit guilty about their lack of patience, isn't that a good service to them?
    - dang 5y ago
      You went way beyond the acceptable limits in this thread. I've defended you in the past because I know you're in a tough minority position in this community, but you can't do this sort of flamewar on HN. Also, it's seriously against HN's rules to use the site primarily to argue about one thing—especially when it's a political or nationalistic issue. We need you to stop doing that and to use HN as intended—for curious conversation about a variety of things. If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.
      - justicezyx 5y ago
        You defended me? I thought you stand for the HN rule and its culture of open and reasonable discussion. If you do think you defend me, then you should see that I am still in a situation where I am becoming more and more attacked based on narrow view on China-related topics, especially politicizing everything to the degree that alternative and reasonable discussions are plainly impossible. If you do still have faith in HN's value, then you should not defend me, you should defend the value. And if you think I am not embodying HN's value, then do whatever you think it's reasonable. I don't care much about personal "support", I have long forsake those narrow views.
        dang 5y ago
        Of course, I'm defending HN's values and on occasion have also defended you when I noticed people posting unfair attacks (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23494968 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23494968). I realize you're representing a minority viewpoint. The HN demographic is highly international, but also overwhelmingly Western, and that inevitably comes with certain biases. We can benefit from hearing perspectives outside those biases. But that only works if you don't break the rules yourself, and you haven't been keeping to that. I get that it's not easy and not fair, but the truth is that the one who represents a minority or contrarian view has to hold themselves to a higher standard [1]. Otherwise you make it easy for people to point fingers at you when you break the rules and use that as an excuse to discredit you [2]—and then they also point fingers at us and demand to know why we aren't enforcing the rules in your case. That's a lose-lose situation: either we have to ban you and silence a minority voice, or we allow you to break rules that would get others banned, in which case people will rightly accuse us of double standards. We can't allow that; I have to be able to say "no, we don't do that" in good conscience. In order to follow the rules we need you to specifically do three things: (1) stay respectful and neutral when arguing; (2) avoid flamewar (your comments in this thread were inflammatory and way over the line, especially because the topic involves multiple flamewar themes - not just China/West but sexual assault etc.); and (3) not use HN primarily to argue about political and national fights. I'm sure there are other things on HN that interest you as well. Good community members engage out of curiosity on a variety of subjects—not just pre-existing agendas on the single point or two that they feel most passionately about. All of this is in the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. [1] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20contrarian%20-dynamic%20-yahoo%20-bentham&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... [2] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=truth%20discredit%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...

What was your original comment?

by clove 5y ago

What was your original comment?

star-trek-fleet 5y ago

[flagged]

throw10920 5y ago
> Edit: Revealing dirty political ploys and get downvoted... I have no idea what HN readers are upholding now... "Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading." - https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html I especially don't appreciate the guilt-tripping in your comment.
- justicezyx 5y ago
  > Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading. Before you automatically cite some site guideline, think it a moment about what happens when a community is collectively positioned with some mental disease. And see how this rule is literally prevent the community from criticizing its own behavior. > guilt-tripping If someone just downvote a informational piece written by someone who clearly demonstrated specific understanding on the topic, then calling them out and let me feel a bit guilty about their lack of patience, isn't that a good service to them?
  - dang 5y ago
    You went way beyond the acceptable limits in this thread. I've defended you in the past because I know you're in a tough minority position in this community, but you can't do this sort of flamewar on HN. Also, it's seriously against HN's rules to use the site primarily to argue about one thing—especially when it's a political or nationalistic issue. We need you to stop doing that and to use HN as intended—for curious conversation about a variety of things. If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.
    - justicezyx 5y ago
      You defended me? I thought you stand for the HN rule and its culture of open and reasonable discussion. If you do think you defend me, then you should see that I am still in a situation where I am becoming more and more attacked based on narrow view on China-related topics, especially politicizing everything to the degree that alternative and reasonable discussions are plainly impossible. If you do still have faith in HN's value, then you should not defend me, you should defend the value. And if you think I am not embodying HN's value, then do whatever you think it's reasonable. I don't care much about personal "support", I have long forsake those narrow views.
      - dang 5y ago
        Of course, I'm defending HN's values and on occasion have also defended you when I noticed people posting unfair attacks (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23494968 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23494968). I realize you're representing a minority viewpoint. The HN demographic is highly international, but also overwhelmingly Western, and that inevitably comes with certain biases. We can benefit from hearing perspectives outside those biases. But that only works if you don't break the rules yourself, and you haven't been keeping to that. I get that it's not easy and not fair, but the truth is that the one who represents a minority or contrarian view has to hold themselves to a higher standard [1]. Otherwise you make it easy for people to point fingers at you when you break the rules and use that as an excuse to discredit you [2]—and then they also point fingers at us and demand to know why we aren't enforcing the rules in your case. That's a lose-lose situation: either we have to ban you and silence a minority voice, or we allow you to break rules that would get others banned, in which case people will rightly accuse us of double standards. We can't allow that; I have to be able to say "no, we don't do that" in good conscience. In order to follow the rules we need you to specifically do three things: (1) stay respectful and neutral when arguing; (2) avoid flamewar (your comments in this thread were inflammatory and way over the line, especially because the topic involves multiple flamewar themes - not just China/West but sexual assault etc.); and (3) not use HN primarily to argue about political and national fights. I'm sure there are other things on HN that interest you as well. Good community members engage out of curiosity on a variety of subjects—not just pre-existing agendas on the single point or two that they feel most passionately about. All of this is in the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. [1] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=by%3Adang%20contrarian%20-dynamic%20-yahoo%20-bentham&sort=byDate&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que... [2] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=truth%20discredit%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...