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"Didn't know context of joke here" Why are people referring to it as a joke? He may have said it in a jocular tone-of-voice, but I don't think it was a joke at

"Didn't know context of joke here" Why are people referring to it as a joke? He may have said it in a jocular tone-of-voice, but I don't think it was a joke at all: it's a reasoned statement to make and furthermore it's a statement I agree with: given US blue-chip companies' propensity to entrench themselves and the CCP's reversion back to authoritarianism (which history has made abundantly clear: rarely ends-well for authoritarians) means that absent anything unexpected happening, the CCP may very-well no-longer exist within a generation or two from now - or at least the CCP won't exist as-we-know-it.

marcus_holmes 5y ago
There is a view of history where the thousands of years of Chinese rule-by-bureaucracy is uninterrupted. My grandfather grew up there and was fond of saying "you have to remember the Chinese did not pray to God. The average Chinese person is not important enough for that. They prayed to the third under-secretary to God's chamberlain. What they really worship is bureaucracy". I don't know China well enough to comment on this myself, but I always found it a fascinating take on the situation.
- dnautics 5y ago
  What is this thousands of years of uninterrupted rule thing? If nothing else there was a period where china's rule was very much interrupted by the mongols, not to mention warring states era, etc.
  - coredog64 5y ago
    The Imperial China period from 200-something BC to 1912 had pretty solid control over a fair chunk of what we think of as modern China.
    - DaiPlusPlus 5y ago
      One could make a similar argument and generalize about Europeans and claim European unity exists because for most of the past 2,000 years practically all states in Europe were under the influence of the Catholic church in some way or another. China's history is as complicated as any other similarly sized territory: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:China_Dynasties.gif https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:China_Dynasties.gif and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_China#/media/File:Divisions_of_Chinese_history.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_China#/media/File:D...
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - marcus_holmes 5y ago
        yes, you're right. There is a view of European history that sees the Roman Empire mutate into the Holy Roman Empire and maintain control over much of Europe for thousands of years (I guess from the end of the Republic in 27BC to the last Holy Roman Emperor in 1806, so not quite "thousands").
        tm-guimaraes 5y ago
        It depends what you mean with "roman empire mutate". HRE had no connection to the Roman Empire besides approval by the papacy. Meanwhile, other "nations" entitled their ruler as a successor, bestowing upon them the title of Caesar, Kaiser, Tsar. So, you can link it up until the fall of Imperial Russia. Or you can even keep it up to today with Romania, or even Turkey. When Constantinople fell, there were no lack of claims.
        marcus_holmes 5y ago
        I'm always fascinated by the idea that some political genius way back in the 4th century realised that the Roman Empire was doomed as a military empire, but could survive as a church (of all things), and then managed to persuade everyone that this was a good idea and get it done. The Roman Empire changed its previous policy of wide tolerance regarding religion, adopted what had been a weird cult as the state religion, and survived its military annihilation (at least in the West - as you say, the story in the East is different).
- AnimalMuppet 5y ago
  He didn't say "China", though. He said "the CCP". They don't have any claim on those thousands of years.
  - marcus_holmes 5y ago
    my point being that the CCP is merely the figurehead, much like the emperor was. It doesn't really matter if the CCP is replaced by something else, the rule-by-bureaucracy continues uninterrupted.
__s 5y ago
1. As I stated, I didn't know anything about this, so I'm using language chosen by those before me on topic 2. You're explaining why this "joke" might be taken serious by CCP 3. Most jokes have a hint of truth to them
- DaiPlusPlus 5y ago
  > You're explaining why this "joke" might be taken serious by CCP Actually, I'm not.
mr_toad 5y ago
> I don't think it was a joke at all: it's a reasoned statement It’s funny ‘cause it’s true.

marcus_holmes 5y ago

There is a view of history where the thousands of years of Chinese rule-by-bureaucracy is uninterrupted. My grandfather grew up there and was fond of saying "you have to remember the Chinese did not pray to God. The average Chinese person is not important enough for that. They prayed to the third under-secretary to God's chamberlain. What they really worship is bureaucracy". I don't know China well enough to comment on this myself, but I always found it a fascinating take on the situation.

dnautics 5y ago
What is this thousands of years of uninterrupted rule thing? If nothing else there was a period where china's rule was very much interrupted by the mongols, not to mention warring states era, etc.
- coredog64 5y ago
  The Imperial China period from 200-something BC to 1912 had pretty solid control over a fair chunk of what we think of as modern China.
  - DaiPlusPlus 5y ago
    One could make a similar argument and generalize about Europeans and claim European unity exists because for most of the past 2,000 years practically all states in Europe were under the influence of the Catholic church in some way or another. China's history is as complicated as any other similarly sized territory: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:China_Dynasties.gif https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:China_Dynasties.gif and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_China#/media/File:Divisions_of_Chinese_history.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_China#/media/File:D...
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - marcus_holmes 5y ago
      yes, you're right. There is a view of European history that sees the Roman Empire mutate into the Holy Roman Empire and maintain control over much of Europe for thousands of years (I guess from the end of the Republic in 27BC to the last Holy Roman Emperor in 1806, so not quite "thousands").
      - tm-guimaraes 5y ago
        It depends what you mean with "roman empire mutate". HRE had no connection to the Roman Empire besides approval by the papacy. Meanwhile, other "nations" entitled their ruler as a successor, bestowing upon them the title of Caesar, Kaiser, Tsar. So, you can link it up until the fall of Imperial Russia. Or you can even keep it up to today with Romania, or even Turkey. When Constantinople fell, there were no lack of claims.
        marcus_holmes 5y ago
        I'm always fascinated by the idea that some political genius way back in the 4th century realised that the Roman Empire was doomed as a military empire, but could survive as a church (of all things), and then managed to persuade everyone that this was a good idea and get it done. The Roman Empire changed its previous policy of wide tolerance regarding religion, adopted what had been a weird cult as the state religion, and survived its military annihilation (at least in the West - as you say, the story in the East is different).
AnimalMuppet 5y ago
He didn't say "China", though. He said "the CCP". They don't have any claim on those thousands of years.
- marcus_holmes 5y ago
  my point being that the CCP is merely the figurehead, much like the emperor was. It doesn't really matter if the CCP is replaced by something else, the rule-by-bureaucracy continues uninterrupted.

__s 5y ago

1. As I stated, I didn't know anything about this, so I'm using language chosen by those before me on topic 2. You're explaining why this "joke" might be taken serious by CCP 3. Most jokes have a hint of truth to them

DaiPlusPlus 5y ago
> You're explaining why this "joke" might be taken serious by CCP Actually, I'm not.

mr_toad 5y ago

> I don't think it was a joke at all: it's a reasoned statement It’s funny ‘cause it’s true.