4 ms·

Apple stops all sales in Turkey after the collapse of the Turkish Lira

44 points by trymas 5y ago

brandrada 5y ago
Having to visit Turkey in the past makes me wonder how far their economy has fallen since my last visitation.
illys 5y ago
The problem is not Apple, this is just symptoms of the crisis. Erdogan developing his personal power and doing nonsense in all political fields (military, diplomatic, economic, democracy, minorities...) with the dream to restore the Ottoman Empire with him as a sultan is the major issue. Turkey is a great country with a great people, but they are living difficult times. A harsh price to pay for following a megalomaniac.
- duxup 5y ago
  While he has been oppressive, he seemed genuinely popular too. It is scary how people can make these kinds of choices.
1cvmask 5y ago
Turkey has a history of currency devaluations. The government is spending too much money on free universal healthcare (Covid did not help at all) and pensions (there are even retirements at the age of 45). So long as they spend more than they save they will have these currency turmoils. Although Government debt to GDP ratio is around 42 percent it is still not sustainable as the currency is not a reserve currency like the dollar or euro. Most of the Asian economies suffered a similar fate in 1998.
- 2Gkashmiri 5y ago
  is spending money on free universal healthcare bad for people living in a country?
  - pokepim 5y ago
    Are you neoconservative living in US? Then yes.
    - 2Gkashmiri 5y ago
      nope. struggling to survive in a hell hole made by the self proclaimed biggest democracy in the world.
  - gruez 5y ago
    Possibly yes, depending on second order effects (eg. more expensive debt in the future, depressed economy,draining savings of people on fixed income)
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - 2Gkashmiri 5y ago
      cool. i don't know what to say. this is like too much to process. you are willing to let the most vulnerable, the poorest of the poor die because they can't afford healthcare because you are concerned it will cause a rise in interest rates in future, economy? no wonder i live in a third world country where you can get medical attention regardless of who you are. yeah, last year or so, a scheme was launched. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayushman_Bharat_Yojana https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayushman_Bharat_Yojana cover of ₹5 lakh (US$6,600) per family per year for a country where unskilled labourers earn "Rs. 500" or $10-12 a day, this level of cover is like magic. the 50 mil population, almost half the population is covered by this scheme alone, not to mention almost free government paid hospitals and dispensaries and other stuff. do you think for these many people, economy and debt and savings matter when their loved one is suffering and they don't have money to pay to a doctor?
- somedude895 5y ago
  With debt that low couldn't they stop printing money and instead increase government spending?
  - wwtrv 5y ago
    Having a low debt to GDP ratio doesn’t help if nobody is willing to lend you money. The yoeld on 10 year Turkish bonds is ~20%. In contrast it’s way cheaper for Greece to pay interest on their debt despite having an over 200% debt ratio since they can borow with much lower interest (~1.3%).
    - 1cvmask 5y ago
      The US since Obama has put many informal sanctions on Turkey to choke the economy. In fact Obama failed to overthrow Erdogan during a coup attempt in July 2016 where he even tried to kill Erdogan and his family. They even managed to bomb the Turkish parliament during the CIA orchestrated coup attempt. The ring leader of the failed coup attempt resides under protection in Pennsylvania and had his residency endorsed by Graham Fuller, CIA head for Moslem countries, and other neocons. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42198399 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42198399
      - WastingMyTime89 5y ago
        Please this is Hacker News not Erdogan daily. You are free to share the preposterous and outlandish propaganda used by Erdogan to justify his authoritarian reforms but don’t expect people to actually believe it. It’s even pointed in the BBC article you are citing despite it being overly sympathetic in my opinion: > To many Turkey-watchers, it smacks of outlandish conspiracy theories. But polls show a majority of Turks firmly believe that the CIA was involved in the failed coup.
      - illys 5y ago
        Your article: "More than 50,000 people have been arrested in Turkey pending trial over links to Mr Gulen. Another 150,000 people have been sacked or suspended from jobs in the public and private sectors since the coup attempt on 15 July 2016." So it is a "coup" organized by 200.000 people? Or the destruction of all political opposition supported by some nice storytelling? It is always a good strategy for candidate dictators to point out the evil foreigners... It guarantees the simple-minded people support.
- sschueller 5y ago
  No country or region should benefit from being a reserve currency. The reserve should be sorry to say a crypto currency that can't be willy nilly printed causing pain to those that aren't benefiting from having a reserve currency.

44 points by trymas 5y ago

Having to visit Turkey in the past makes me wonder how far their economy has fallen since my last visitation.

The problem is not Apple, this is just symptoms of the crisis. Erdogan developing his personal power and doing nonsense in all political fields (military, diplomatic, economic, democracy, minorities...) with the dream to restore the Ottoman Empire with him as a sultan is the major issue. Turkey is a great country with a great people, but they are living difficult times. A harsh price to pay for following a megalomaniac.

duxup 5y ago
While he has been oppressive, he seemed genuinely popular too. It is scary how people can make these kinds of choices.

1cvmask 5y ago

Turkey has a history of currency devaluations. The government is spending too much money on free universal healthcare (Covid did not help at all) and pensions (there are even retirements at the age of 45). So long as they spend more than they save they will have these currency turmoils. Although Government debt to GDP ratio is around 42 percent it is still not sustainable as the currency is not a reserve currency like the dollar or euro. Most of the Asian economies suffered a similar fate in 1998.

2Gkashmiri 5y ago
is spending money on free universal healthcare bad for people living in a country?
- pokepim 5y ago
  Are you neoconservative living in US? Then yes.
  - 2Gkashmiri 5y ago
    nope. struggling to survive in a hell hole made by the self proclaimed biggest democracy in the world.
- gruez 5y ago
  Possibly yes, depending on second order effects (eg. more expensive debt in the future, depressed economy,draining savings of people on fixed income)
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - 2Gkashmiri 5y ago
    cool. i don't know what to say. this is like too much to process. you are willing to let the most vulnerable, the poorest of the poor die because they can't afford healthcare because you are concerned it will cause a rise in interest rates in future, economy? no wonder i live in a third world country where you can get medical attention regardless of who you are. yeah, last year or so, a scheme was launched. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayushman_Bharat_Yojana https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayushman_Bharat_Yojana cover of ₹5 lakh (US$6,600) per family per year for a country where unskilled labourers earn "Rs. 500" or $10-12 a day, this level of cover is like magic. the 50 mil population, almost half the population is covered by this scheme alone, not to mention almost free government paid hospitals and dispensaries and other stuff. do you think for these many people, economy and debt and savings matter when their loved one is suffering and they don't have money to pay to a doctor?
somedude895 5y ago
With debt that low couldn't they stop printing money and instead increase government spending?
- wwtrv 5y ago
  Having a low debt to GDP ratio doesn’t help if nobody is willing to lend you money. The yoeld on 10 year Turkish bonds is ~20%. In contrast it’s way cheaper for Greece to pay interest on their debt despite having an over 200% debt ratio since they can borow with much lower interest (~1.3%).
  - 1cvmask 5y ago
    The US since Obama has put many informal sanctions on Turkey to choke the economy. In fact Obama failed to overthrow Erdogan during a coup attempt in July 2016 where he even tried to kill Erdogan and his family. They even managed to bomb the Turkish parliament during the CIA orchestrated coup attempt. The ring leader of the failed coup attempt resides under protection in Pennsylvania and had his residency endorsed by Graham Fuller, CIA head for Moslem countries, and other neocons. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42198399 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-42198399
    - WastingMyTime89 5y ago
      Please this is Hacker News not Erdogan daily. You are free to share the preposterous and outlandish propaganda used by Erdogan to justify his authoritarian reforms but don’t expect people to actually believe it. It’s even pointed in the BBC article you are citing despite it being overly sympathetic in my opinion: > To many Turkey-watchers, it smacks of outlandish conspiracy theories. But polls show a majority of Turks firmly believe that the CIA was involved in the failed coup.
    - illys 5y ago
      Your article: "More than 50,000 people have been arrested in Turkey pending trial over links to Mr Gulen. Another 150,000 people have been sacked or suspended from jobs in the public and private sectors since the coup attempt on 15 July 2016." So it is a "coup" organized by 200.000 people? Or the destruction of all political opposition supported by some nice storytelling? It is always a good strategy for candidate dictators to point out the evil foreigners... It guarantees the simple-minded people support.
sschueller 5y ago
No country or region should benefit from being a reserve currency. The reserve should be sorry to say a crypto currency that can't be willy nilly printed causing pain to those that aren't benefiting from having a reserve currency.