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Repair is nowhere near fundamental enough to be considered a right. There is a reason it's not in the Constitution. The other rights give people the ability to

Repair is nowhere near fundamental enough to be considered a right. There is a reason it's not in the Constitution. The other rights give people the ability to repair things.

GauntletWizard 5y ago
Repair isn't a natural right, but it is a natural consequence of natural rights. IF you don't own your devices enough to swap components, flash their firmware, and root around their insides, your natural rights of ownership over your possessions are being trampled. Your freedom to tinker is your freedom to learn and think. Your freedom to break and reprogram is your freedom to protest. Your freedom to change and repurpose is freedom to be secure against search and seizure. These freedoms are being trampled by corporations that are certain that their right to profit overrides them - Don't let them. No, "Repair" isn't a right in and of itself, but by the time you've lost the ability to, you've lost all of your other rights.
- Shared404 5y ago
  > No, "Repair" isn't a right in and of itself, but by the time you've lost the ability to, you've lost all of your other rights. If you don't mind, I'll be stealing this the next time someone doesn't understand why I care so much about r2r.
- JoeyBananas 5y ago
  Sure, but r2r activists are doing things such as requiring OEMs to sell spare parts and release proprietary documentation. That is where I draw the line, it is clearly government overreach.
klyrs 5y ago
> There is a reason it's not in the Constitution. Indeed, DRM hadn't been invented yet. The simplicity of manufacturing technology available was what gave people the ability to repair things. And, don't forget the Ninth. The enumerated rights are not exhaustive.
salawat 5y ago
2nd Amendment. A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed. The keep there bundles the acts of manufacture, upkeep, and maintenance. Arms? What is a man's tool if not his weapon beared in the everyday struggle that is keeping civilization peacefully chugging along day by day. You may disagree with the broad reading; but hell, if everyone else gets to split hairs to try to turn these damn things into an excuse to shackle people's liberties, might as well have an interpretation or two grant a few back.
- JoeyBananas 5y ago
  A much more convincing argument would be that r2r falls under the umbrella of the right to private property in general. What you're saying would only apply to r2r for weapons. Repair is a right, but the right to repair movement goes far beyond the right of an individual to do what they want with their property. R2r involves requiring businesses to sell spair parts and go out of their way to support people who want to repair things.
  - salawat 5y ago
    I was replying to the assertion that no Constitutionally granted right suggests a right to repair. The 2nd Amendment very clearly does in explicitly calling out a citizen's right to keep arms, which back then also meant in being secure I the capacity to keep those arms operating. Nevermind the 10tg that calls out everything not explicitly listed, and sets up an implicit grant to the People of any Rights not specifically disincluded by State Constitutions. So the entire assertion of the non-existence of a right to repair is fundamentally ludicrous.

Repair is nowhere near fundamental enough to be considered a right. There is a reason it's not in the Constitution. The other rights give people the ability to repair things.

GauntletWizard 5y ago

Repair isn't a natural right, but it is a natural consequence of natural rights. IF you don't own your devices enough to swap components, flash their firmware, and root around their insides, your natural rights of ownership over your possessions are being trampled. Your freedom to tinker is your freedom to learn and think. Your freedom to break and reprogram is your freedom to protest. Your freedom to change and repurpose is freedom to be secure against search and seizure. These freedoms are being trampled by corporations that are certain that their right to profit overrides them - Don't let them. No, "Repair" isn't a right in and of itself, but by the time you've lost the ability to, you've lost all of your other rights.

Shared404 5y ago
> No, "Repair" isn't a right in and of itself, but by the time you've lost the ability to, you've lost all of your other rights. If you don't mind, I'll be stealing this the next time someone doesn't understand why I care so much about r2r.
JoeyBananas 5y ago
Sure, but r2r activists are doing things such as requiring OEMs to sell spare parts and release proprietary documentation. That is where I draw the line, it is clearly government overreach.

klyrs 5y ago

> There is a reason it's not in the Constitution. Indeed, DRM hadn't been invented yet. The simplicity of manufacturing technology available was what gave people the ability to repair things. And, don't forget the Ninth. The enumerated rights are not exhaustive.

salawat 5y ago

2nd Amendment. A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed. The keep there bundles the acts of manufacture, upkeep, and maintenance. Arms? What is a man's tool if not his weapon beared in the everyday struggle that is keeping civilization peacefully chugging along day by day. You may disagree with the broad reading; but hell, if everyone else gets to split hairs to try to turn these damn things into an excuse to shackle people's liberties, might as well have an interpretation or two grant a few back.

JoeyBananas 5y ago
A much more convincing argument would be that r2r falls under the umbrella of the right to private property in general. What you're saying would only apply to r2r for weapons. Repair is a right, but the right to repair movement goes far beyond the right of an individual to do what they want with their property. R2r involves requiring businesses to sell spair parts and go out of their way to support people who want to repair things.
- salawat 5y ago
  I was replying to the assertion that no Constitutionally granted right suggests a right to repair. The 2nd Amendment very clearly does in explicitly calling out a citizen's right to keep arms, which back then also meant in being secure I the capacity to keep those arms operating. Nevermind the 10tg that calls out everything not explicitly listed, and sets up an implicit grant to the People of any Rights not specifically disincluded by State Constitutions. So the entire assertion of the non-existence of a right to repair is fundamentally ludicrous.