3 ms·

'Nobody forced them into slavery, why didn't they just go somewhere else?'

xyzzyz 5y ago
People actually were forced into slavery, and actually are not forced to work for Facebook. Do you often exploit slaves as a rhetorical tool?
- netizen-936824 5y ago
  Have you heard of the concept of 'wage slavery'? People at the lowest paid tiers of society do not have a choice
HideousKojima 5y ago
Slavery, by its very definition, involves force. From Merriam-Webster's dictionary: Someone who is legally owned by another person and is forced to work for that person without pay
- netizen-936824 5y ago
  That's the point I was trying to make. Generally employees do not actually have much of a choice, if any. Especially if they have families to provide for so the distinction is rather moot
  - HideousKojima 5y ago
    Employees can find another job. Or they can choose to have no job, and potentially starve to death etc. But the latter is the default of the human condition, and has little to do with the whims of corporations.
    - netizen-936824 5y ago
      Ah yes they can just choose to starve to death! Couldn't slaves make the choice to be beaten to death or executed for not working? Thank you for proving my point
      - HideousKojima 5y ago
        If you're suggesting that human beings are "slaves" to the natural condition, yes. Work or starve has been the default state of humanity (and all forms of life on Earth) since the dawn of time. It's not "slavery" or "capitalism" or anything else, it's the default state of being.
        netizen-936824 5y ago
        Oh my apologies, I guess that excuses paying people so little that they can't survive off the wages and need food assistance from the government. Capitalism truly has all the answers! Companies were in a race to the bottom for wages, and many still are. People working these jobs sure maybe they can get an education, or get a foot in somewhere else. What about the next person to fill the shitty role they left? It's a continuous cycle of shitting on the lowest paid people in society and it needs to stop
  - jkljkljkl1 5y ago
    Employees have numerous options? Slaves cant just get a new master, it was criminal to escape?
    - netizen-936824 5y ago
      Does an unskilled laborer have options in silicon valley? What options are those?
      - jkljkljkl1 5y ago
        Seems like goalposts, wasn't the thread about Facebook monitoring it's employees'? What unskilled labor is that?
        netizen-936824 5y ago
        The post I initially responded to was about employers in general, and that post was responding to something about Facebook. This transitioned the conversation to the overarching theme of employer/employee relationship and pay
- heavyset_go 5y ago
  Slavery isn't just chattel slavery, it comes in many forms, including wage slavery. The abolitionist and former slave Frederick Douglass had this to say on the subject[1]: > [E]xperience demonstrates that there may be a slavery of wages only a little less galling and crushing in its effects than chattel slavery, and that this slavery of wages must go down with the other From Wikipedia[1]: > Douglass went on to speak about these conditions as arising from the unequal bargaining power between the ownership/capitalist class and the non-ownership/laborer class within a compulsory monetary market: "No more crafty and effective devise for defrauding the southern laborers could be adopted than the one that substitutes orders upon shopkeepers for currency in payment of wages. It has the merit of a show of honesty, while it puts the laborer completely at the mercy of the land-owner and the shopkeeper" [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_slavery#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_slavery#History
  - jkljkljkl1 5y ago
    Working at FB isn't wage slavery, though, is it? If they can work there, cant they go get a similar job?
    - netizen-936824 5y ago
      The issue goes far beyond Facebook and extends to nearly all US companies. It seems disingenuous to suggest otherwise

People actually were forced into slavery, and actually are not forced to work for Facebook. Do you often exploit slaves as a rhetorical tool?

netizen-936824 5y ago
Have you heard of the concept of 'wage slavery'? People at the lowest paid tiers of society do not have a choice

HideousKojima 5y ago

Slavery, by its very definition, involves force. From Merriam-Webster's dictionary: Someone who is legally owned by another person and is forced to work for that person without pay

netizen-936824 5y ago
That's the point I was trying to make. Generally employees do not actually have much of a choice, if any. Especially if they have families to provide for so the distinction is rather moot
- HideousKojima 5y ago
  Employees can find another job. Or they can choose to have no job, and potentially starve to death etc. But the latter is the default of the human condition, and has little to do with the whims of corporations.
  - netizen-936824 5y ago
    Ah yes they can just choose to starve to death! Couldn't slaves make the choice to be beaten to death or executed for not working? Thank you for proving my point
    - HideousKojima 5y ago
      If you're suggesting that human beings are "slaves" to the natural condition, yes. Work or starve has been the default state of humanity (and all forms of life on Earth) since the dawn of time. It's not "slavery" or "capitalism" or anything else, it's the default state of being.
      - netizen-936824 5y ago
        Oh my apologies, I guess that excuses paying people so little that they can't survive off the wages and need food assistance from the government. Capitalism truly has all the answers! Companies were in a race to the bottom for wages, and many still are. People working these jobs sure maybe they can get an education, or get a foot in somewhere else. What about the next person to fill the shitty role they left? It's a continuous cycle of shitting on the lowest paid people in society and it needs to stop
- jkljkljkl1 5y ago
  Employees have numerous options? Slaves cant just get a new master, it was criminal to escape?
  - netizen-936824 5y ago
    Does an unskilled laborer have options in silicon valley? What options are those?
    - jkljkljkl1 5y ago
      Seems like goalposts, wasn't the thread about Facebook monitoring it's employees'? What unskilled labor is that?
      - netizen-936824 5y ago
        The post I initially responded to was about employers in general, and that post was responding to something about Facebook. This transitioned the conversation to the overarching theme of employer/employee relationship and pay
heavyset_go 5y ago
Slavery isn't just chattel slavery, it comes in many forms, including wage slavery. The abolitionist and former slave Frederick Douglass had this to say on the subject[1]: > [E]xperience demonstrates that there may be a slavery of wages only a little less galling and crushing in its effects than chattel slavery, and that this slavery of wages must go down with the other From Wikipedia[1]: > Douglass went on to speak about these conditions as arising from the unequal bargaining power between the ownership/capitalist class and the non-ownership/laborer class within a compulsory monetary market: "No more crafty and effective devise for defrauding the southern laborers could be adopted than the one that substitutes orders upon shopkeepers for currency in payment of wages. It has the merit of a show of honesty, while it puts the laborer completely at the mercy of the land-owner and the shopkeeper" [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_slavery#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_slavery#History
- jkljkljkl1 5y ago
  Working at FB isn't wage slavery, though, is it? If they can work there, cant they go get a similar job?
  - netizen-936824 5y ago
    The issue goes far beyond Facebook and extends to nearly all US companies. It seems disingenuous to suggest otherwise