4 ms·

What hardware do you use? And how were you able to get hold of something that doesn't talk to the cloud? There's nothing like that in the shops here.

pkulak 5y ago
Most of my stuff is ZWave which is 100% local (big Zooz fan, and I hear that Inovelli is just as good). I have a bunch of Lutron switches too, and a couple Hue bulbs. Both of those will technically phone home, but you can cut off their WAN access and they still work just fine. I control everything with an old Mac Mini running Home Assistant. The trick is, before you buy anything, look it up on Home Assistant. If its "class" is "local push", you're golden: https://www.home-assistant.io/blog/2016/02/12/classifying-the-internet-of-things/ https://www.home-assistant.io/blog/2016/02/12/classifying-th...
- efitz 5y ago
  You’re lucky or do Zwave in a small way. I spent a lot of money converting my last home to zwave and found tons of problems with it; incompatibility between the different devices from the same manufacturer; inconsistent implementation of standards by device type, etc. I am having a way better experience with Lutron Caseta (different problem is that I ran out of space on a single hub at 75 devices). The other big problem with smart home is that every company wants to own the ecosystem. The technical term for that is “greedy bastards”. It’s not cloud; it’s cloud lock-in that’s the problem as I see it. This is the source not only of reliability problems but also of compatibility and interoperability problems. When I started on my IoT journey I adopted a hard requirement that everything must “fail normal” - I don’t want a call in the middle of the night for tech support while I’m traveling on business, because my family can’t turn on the lights. Everything in my house fails normal- if the cloud or the internet goes away, the house becomes a dumb house and you can still turn on/off anything with a switch.
  - theshrike79 5y ago
    > The other big problem with smart home is that every company wants to own the ecosystem Nah, standards assist everyone. Thus Matter[0] is becoming a thing. It will be supported by pretty much everyone (Amazon, Apple, Google, Samsung SmartThings and the Zigbee Alliance). "Fail normal" is a good thing to keep in mind nevertheless.
    - outworlder 5y ago
      I am quite skeptical that "Matter" (formerly CHIP?) will fix anything. https://xkcd.com/927/ https://xkcd.com/927/
  - pkulak 5y ago
    Agree 100%. If I cut the Ethernet to my router with garden sheers, none of my automations run and I'm left with a bunch of normal light switches and locks, like any other house. And I have about 20 ZWave devices. They've been super reliable, but, it's a small house, so I can't speak for what would happen if I quadrupled. My Caseta stuff has been just as reliable.
- stavros 5y ago
  I have the same experience as you, but I use Zigbee stuff (a bit more future-proof and open, ZWave is proprietary). I also love the Sonoff line of devices with Espurna or Tasmota. Everything has been rock solid.
- enobrev 5y ago
  I have a similar experience with ZWave, and definitely recommend Inovelli (I'm also a Zooz fan). I had everything on HA, but at the time they were changing _everything_ way too quickly for me. After the last time I'd lost my entire Zwave network setup, I figured it was a great time to try something now. So, now it's a single ~1k line javascript file that handles all my automation, built atop zwave2mqtt (hoping to move to zwavejs soon - maybe over the holiday). It's simple, solid, and very easy to maintain. I could use a UI, and occasionally dream of building one, but honestly I generally forget the place is automated. It all just sorta works.
  - throwaway9870 5y ago
    That is exactly what I want to do for the same reason. Any chance you would be willing to share your JS code?
    - enobrev 5y ago
      I'm not comfortable sharing the whole thing, since it's very specific to my house. But I may be able to come up with a much lighter version that could be shared. No idea when I'll find the time, but if you want to email me (check my profile), I'll reach out when I find the chance to do so.
rendall 5y ago
check out https://www.home-assistant.io/ https://www.home-assistant.io/ Open source. You can be as fiddly or stable as you have tolerance for.
- hanklazard 5y ago
  I run this too, nothing but positive things to say. I update it every once in a while, but I has been rock solid for years.
- 6gvONxR4sf7o 5y ago
  Any tips for those who want a simple stable setup?
  - pkulak 5y ago
    Lutron Caseta. I personally like ZWave/ZigBee stuff more because it's more configurable and open, Lutron cannot be broken, even if you try.
- outworlder 5y ago
  You can even buy their pre-installed box, ready to go. It has some warts, but my automation would not be viable without it. I specially like the NodeRED integration - even if I think that NodeRED is quite quirky and %#@!% sometimes, it's still neat to be able to write automations without programming much. I do plenty of that on my day job. Also a great visual aid to explain to non-technical people.
theshrike79 5y ago
Philips Hue + Apple HomeKit with a dedicated hub (Apple TV or HomePod will do fine). HomeKit stuff can be controlled remotely, but it doesn't "talk to the cloud" as much as IFTTT or Samsung SmartThings based stuff. After you hit a wall with the Hue native automations + HomeKit, Home Assistant is pretty much the only relevant shop in town, maybe enhanced with NodeRED.
garblegarble 5y ago
You can also reflash the firmware on a lot of smart plugs if they use ESP32, look up Tasmota. I use Sonoff plugs, the first thing I do when I get one is solder headers on them and reflash their firmware - hey presto, no cloud
giva 5y ago
I use KNX for the "important" lights. KNX is very reliable and completely decentralized, so it continues to work evern if the server crashes, but it is also very expensive. For all the utility lights, I use ZigBee. For irrigation, wifi+mqtt. Everything is controlled by openHAB, i need to check out HomeAssistant in the near future.
ridiculous_fish 5y ago
I have three Nanoleaf Essentials bulbs. These are RGB LEDs which screw into ordinary A19 sockets. They work over Thread, so no connection to the Internet or my WiFi. My HomePod Mini is the Thread router. The setup is very cool. I say "Hey Siri, good morning" before I get out of bed, and the lights turn on. Siri also understands more complicated requests like "set the center light to cyan" or "set all the lights to 50%." I also save configurations ("Scenes") and Siri can apply them by name. Importantly the fixture has a physical switch and the bulbs reset to ordinary white after powering off, so the bulbs fail like an escalator if the WiFi is down. No relation to any of these products, just a happy customer.

pkulak 5y ago

Most of my stuff is ZWave which is 100% local (big Zooz fan, and I hear that Inovelli is just as good). I have a bunch of Lutron switches too, and a couple Hue bulbs. Both of those will technically phone home, but you can cut off their WAN access and they still work just fine. I control everything with an old Mac Mini running Home Assistant. The trick is, before you buy anything, look it up on Home Assistant. If its "class" is "local push", you're golden: https://www.home-assistant.io/blog/2016/02/12/classifying-the-internet-of-things/ https://www.home-assistant.io/blog/2016/02/12/classifying-th...

efitz 5y ago
You’re lucky or do Zwave in a small way. I spent a lot of money converting my last home to zwave and found tons of problems with it; incompatibility between the different devices from the same manufacturer; inconsistent implementation of standards by device type, etc. I am having a way better experience with Lutron Caseta (different problem is that I ran out of space on a single hub at 75 devices). The other big problem with smart home is that every company wants to own the ecosystem. The technical term for that is “greedy bastards”. It’s not cloud; it’s cloud lock-in that’s the problem as I see it. This is the source not only of reliability problems but also of compatibility and interoperability problems. When I started on my IoT journey I adopted a hard requirement that everything must “fail normal” - I don’t want a call in the middle of the night for tech support while I’m traveling on business, because my family can’t turn on the lights. Everything in my house fails normal- if the cloud or the internet goes away, the house becomes a dumb house and you can still turn on/off anything with a switch.
- theshrike79 5y ago
  > The other big problem with smart home is that every company wants to own the ecosystem Nah, standards assist everyone. Thus Matter[0] is becoming a thing. It will be supported by pretty much everyone (Amazon, Apple, Google, Samsung SmartThings and the Zigbee Alliance). "Fail normal" is a good thing to keep in mind nevertheless.
  - outworlder 5y ago
    I am quite skeptical that "Matter" (formerly CHIP?) will fix anything. https://xkcd.com/927/ https://xkcd.com/927/
- pkulak 5y ago
  Agree 100%. If I cut the Ethernet to my router with garden sheers, none of my automations run and I'm left with a bunch of normal light switches and locks, like any other house. And I have about 20 ZWave devices. They've been super reliable, but, it's a small house, so I can't speak for what would happen if I quadrupled. My Caseta stuff has been just as reliable.
stavros 5y ago
I have the same experience as you, but I use Zigbee stuff (a bit more future-proof and open, ZWave is proprietary). I also love the Sonoff line of devices with Espurna or Tasmota. Everything has been rock solid.
enobrev 5y ago
I have a similar experience with ZWave, and definitely recommend Inovelli (I'm also a Zooz fan). I had everything on HA, but at the time they were changing _everything_ way too quickly for me. After the last time I'd lost my entire Zwave network setup, I figured it was a great time to try something now. So, now it's a single ~1k line javascript file that handles all my automation, built atop zwave2mqtt (hoping to move to zwavejs soon - maybe over the holiday). It's simple, solid, and very easy to maintain. I could use a UI, and occasionally dream of building one, but honestly I generally forget the place is automated. It all just sorta works.
- throwaway9870 5y ago
  That is exactly what I want to do for the same reason. Any chance you would be willing to share your JS code?
  - enobrev 5y ago
    I'm not comfortable sharing the whole thing, since it's very specific to my house. But I may be able to come up with a much lighter version that could be shared. No idea when I'll find the time, but if you want to email me (check my profile), I'll reach out when I find the chance to do so.

rendall 5y ago

check out https://www.home-assistant.io/ https://www.home-assistant.io/ Open source. You can be as fiddly or stable as you have tolerance for.

hanklazard 5y ago
I run this too, nothing but positive things to say. I update it every once in a while, but I has been rock solid for years.
6gvONxR4sf7o 5y ago
Any tips for those who want a simple stable setup?
- pkulak 5y ago
  Lutron Caseta. I personally like ZWave/ZigBee stuff more because it's more configurable and open, Lutron cannot be broken, even if you try.
outworlder 5y ago
You can even buy their pre-installed box, ready to go. It has some warts, but my automation would not be viable without it. I specially like the NodeRED integration - even if I think that NodeRED is quite quirky and %#@!% sometimes, it's still neat to be able to write automations without programming much. I do plenty of that on my day job. Also a great visual aid to explain to non-technical people.

theshrike79 5y ago

Philips Hue + Apple HomeKit with a dedicated hub (Apple TV or HomePod will do fine). HomeKit stuff can be controlled remotely, but it doesn't "talk to the cloud" as much as IFTTT or Samsung SmartThings based stuff. After you hit a wall with the Hue native automations + HomeKit, Home Assistant is pretty much the only relevant shop in town, maybe enhanced with NodeRED.

garblegarble 5y ago

You can also reflash the firmware on a lot of smart plugs if they use ESP32, look up Tasmota. I use Sonoff plugs, the first thing I do when I get one is solder headers on them and reflash their firmware - hey presto, no cloud

giva 5y ago

I use KNX for the "important" lights. KNX is very reliable and completely decentralized, so it continues to work evern if the server crashes, but it is also very expensive. For all the utility lights, I use ZigBee. For irrigation, wifi+mqtt. Everything is controlled by openHAB, i need to check out HomeAssistant in the near future.

ridiculous_fish 5y ago

I have three Nanoleaf Essentials bulbs. These are RGB LEDs which screw into ordinary A19 sockets. They work over Thread, so no connection to the Internet or my WiFi. My HomePod Mini is the Thread router. The setup is very cool. I say "Hey Siri, good morning" before I get out of bed, and the lights turn on. Siri also understands more complicated requests like "set the center light to cyan" or "set all the lights to 50%." I also save configurations ("Scenes") and Siri can apply them by name. Importantly the fixture has a physical switch and the bulbs reset to ordinary white after powering off, so the bulbs fail like an escalator if the WiFi is down. No relation to any of these products, just a happy customer.