I think the trick is, that state needs to be carefully considered at an overall systems level, not just client vs server. That's quite hard, so many (most?) dev

I think the trick is, that state needs to be carefully considered at an overall systems level, not just client vs server. That's quite hard, so many (most?) devs don't do it. Certainly, I've seen state managed well using jquery, and even vanilla JS in the ES5 era, so frameworks don't make it possible, it's always been so. So the question is, do frameworks make it easier? I don't think they really do. I think they make it easier to manipulate state, but not designing your system will still mean state being mismanaged.