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These companies can get big enough to be acquired by AWS , Azure at some point. This is now the new Heroku. The next big startup could be an application on Ver

These companies can get big enough to be acquired by AWS , Azure at some point. This is now the new Heroku. The next big startup could be an application on Vercel maintained by 2 people instead of a tangle of micro services and AWS configurations maintained by 20.

ushakov 5y ago
they don't run backend/databases though?
- danpalmer 5y ago
  This is likely fine for the typical "Digital Transformation" projects at huge enterprises that have a ton of cash to spend on things like this. Everything is a Mainframe or SAP installation under the hood somewhere, but layers and layers of API mean that product teams can mostly ignore the complexity and ship a mediocre app that is only really a frontend.
- icemelt8 5y ago
  Good point, for that there is another hot category of startups, such as Supabase and nhost.
- ratww 5y ago
  They do have Edge Functions, which is similar to Lambda. Same with Netlify and Cloudflare. For DBs you have to seek somewhere else. It's not really something that will run your Rails backend, but it has the potential of doing a lot for creative small teams.
  - ushakov 5y ago
    why would any sane person vendor-lock-in all backend code to a single provider?
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - addandsubtract 5y ago
      You don't. You write your backend code and vercel (and others) turn it into serverless functions that can be deployed on AWS or Cloudflare. Or whoever else decides to offer serverless functions. Or you extract your backend and host it yourself. You're not vendor locking yourself.
    - archeroed 5y ago
      Haven't yet used their /api serveless functions but I guess it's standard nodejs functions, so not that much vendor lockin
    - pritambarhate 5y ago
      You can deploy next.js application on any server which supports Node.js.
  - leerob 5y ago
    To clarify, we have Serverless Functions[1] which are similar to Lambda, as well as Edge Functions[2] which are similar to Cloudflare Workers. [1] https://vercel.com/docs/concepts/functions/serverless-functions https://vercel.com/docs/concepts/functions/serverless-functi... [2] https://vercel.com/edge https://vercel.com/edge
    - youngtaff 5y ago
      Where are your edge locations - doesn’t seem to be any information on your site…
- viginti_tres 5y ago
  AFAIK they're working on it
ryanSrich 5y ago
Herkou’s exit wasn’t that great though. Granted, $200m isn’t an insignificant amount of money, but Netlify and Vercel are valued at billions. They would have to sell for 10x what Heroku sold for to meet expectations. I just don’t see the valuations lining up, but I’ll probably be wrong. I also don’t know who they get acquired by. I don’t see AWS making acquisitions like this. From what I’ve seen, it seems like they try to buy companies at lower valuations (than multiple billions).
- thewarrior 5y ago
  These companies can be disruptive innovators by focusing on Niches that the big companies won’t care about because they’re tiny. For eg - managed react applications. IIRC Firebase was acquired by google. But the plan is to go after all of AWS slowly from a different direction. Cloud flare is doing the same thing and their stock is going gangbusters. Cloud services are one of the most profitable businesses to ever exist. There’s so much lock in and network effects. Especially with managed solutions like these.
  - ignoramous 5y ago
    But: The Innovator's Solution to the Innovator's Dilemma is well-understood at this point. Incumbents know well to not ignore upstarts. Knowing (Intel v ARM [0]) and reacting are two different things, of course. [0] ref "red teaming at Intel", https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21095977 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21095977
    - thewarrior 5y ago
      It’s not easy because of all the bureaucracies and inefficiencies at large companies. Most employees at AWS are probably barely inspired compared to the people working at Vercel who can also ship much faster. Nothing new here just what PG has been saying for years.
      - ignoramous 5y ago
        > It’s not easy because of all the bureaucracies and inefficiencies at large companies. The Innovator's Solution addresses these and other issues. http://web.mit.edu/6.933/www/Fall2000/teradyne/clay.html http://web.mit.edu/6.933/www/Fall2000/teradyne/clay.html: Even after correctly identifying potentially disruptive technologies, firms still must circumvent its hierarchy and bureaucracy that can stifle the free pursuit of creative ideas. Christensen suggests that firms need to provide experimental groups within the company a freer rein. "With a few exceptions, the only instances in which mainstream firms have successfully established a timely position in a disruptive technology were those in which the firms' managers set up an autonomous organization charged with building a new and independent business around the disruptive technology." This autonomous organization will then be able to choose the customers it answers to, choose how much profit it needs to make, and how to run its business.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
nkotov 5y ago
AWS most likely won't acquire - they'd rather build their own solution that does 80% of the job okay.
- kylegill 5y ago
  Can confirm, AWS Amplify got 80% of my job done trying to deploy and manage a FE stack.
jmacd 5y ago
Being "acquirable" is one of the things you often forego at valuations like this.
- thewarrior 5y ago
  Why ? Valuations are generally high these days and Big tech has the cash. If there’s a crash all valuations go down and they’re even more acquirable. The acquisition doesn’t have to happen at these valuations for the investors to make money. See - Liquidation preferences

ushakov 5y ago

they don't run backend/databases though?

danpalmer 5y ago
This is likely fine for the typical "Digital Transformation" projects at huge enterprises that have a ton of cash to spend on things like this. Everything is a Mainframe or SAP installation under the hood somewhere, but layers and layers of API mean that product teams can mostly ignore the complexity and ship a mediocre app that is only really a frontend.
icemelt8 5y ago
Good point, for that there is another hot category of startups, such as Supabase and nhost.
ratww 5y ago
They do have Edge Functions, which is similar to Lambda. Same with Netlify and Cloudflare. For DBs you have to seek somewhere else. It's not really something that will run your Rails backend, but it has the potential of doing a lot for creative small teams.
- ushakov 5y ago
  why would any sane person vendor-lock-in all backend code to a single provider?
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - addandsubtract 5y ago
    You don't. You write your backend code and vercel (and others) turn it into serverless functions that can be deployed on AWS or Cloudflare. Or whoever else decides to offer serverless functions. Or you extract your backend and host it yourself. You're not vendor locking yourself.
  - archeroed 5y ago
    Haven't yet used their /api serveless functions but I guess it's standard nodejs functions, so not that much vendor lockin
  - pritambarhate 5y ago
    You can deploy next.js application on any server which supports Node.js.
- leerob 5y ago
  To clarify, we have Serverless Functions[1] which are similar to Lambda, as well as Edge Functions[2] which are similar to Cloudflare Workers. [1] https://vercel.com/docs/concepts/functions/serverless-functions https://vercel.com/docs/concepts/functions/serverless-functi... [2] https://vercel.com/edge https://vercel.com/edge
  - youngtaff 5y ago
    Where are your edge locations - doesn’t seem to be any information on your site…
viginti_tres 5y ago
AFAIK they're working on it

ryanSrich 5y ago

Herkou’s exit wasn’t that great though. Granted, $200m isn’t an insignificant amount of money, but Netlify and Vercel are valued at billions. They would have to sell for 10x what Heroku sold for to meet expectations. I just don’t see the valuations lining up, but I’ll probably be wrong. I also don’t know who they get acquired by. I don’t see AWS making acquisitions like this. From what I’ve seen, it seems like they try to buy companies at lower valuations (than multiple billions).

thewarrior 5y ago
These companies can be disruptive innovators by focusing on Niches that the big companies won’t care about because they’re tiny. For eg - managed react applications. IIRC Firebase was acquired by google. But the plan is to go after all of AWS slowly from a different direction. Cloud flare is doing the same thing and their stock is going gangbusters. Cloud services are one of the most profitable businesses to ever exist. There’s so much lock in and network effects. Especially with managed solutions like these.
- ignoramous 5y ago
  But: The Innovator's Solution to the Innovator's Dilemma is well-understood at this point. Incumbents know well to not ignore upstarts. Knowing (Intel v ARM [0]) and reacting are two different things, of course. [0] ref "red teaming at Intel", https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21095977 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21095977
  - thewarrior 5y ago
    It’s not easy because of all the bureaucracies and inefficiencies at large companies. Most employees at AWS are probably barely inspired compared to the people working at Vercel who can also ship much faster. Nothing new here just what PG has been saying for years.
    - ignoramous 5y ago
      > It’s not easy because of all the bureaucracies and inefficiencies at large companies. The Innovator's Solution addresses these and other issues. http://web.mit.edu/6.933/www/Fall2000/teradyne/clay.html http://web.mit.edu/6.933/www/Fall2000/teradyne/clay.html: Even after correctly identifying potentially disruptive technologies, firms still must circumvent its hierarchy and bureaucracy that can stifle the free pursuit of creative ideas. Christensen suggests that firms need to provide experimental groups within the company a freer rein. "With a few exceptions, the only instances in which mainstream firms have successfully established a timely position in a disruptive technology were those in which the firms' managers set up an autonomous organization charged with building a new and independent business around the disruptive technology." This autonomous organization will then be able to choose the customers it answers to, choose how much profit it needs to make, and how to run its business.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

nkotov 5y ago

AWS most likely won't acquire - they'd rather build their own solution that does 80% of the job okay.

kylegill 5y ago
Can confirm, AWS Amplify got 80% of my job done trying to deploy and manage a FE stack.

jmacd 5y ago

Being "acquirable" is one of the things you often forego at valuations like this.

thewarrior 5y ago
Why ? Valuations are generally high these days and Big tech has the cash. If there’s a crash all valuations go down and they’re even more acquirable. The acquisition doesn’t have to happen at these valuations for the investors to make money. See - Liquidation preferences